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Lad-DN

Staff for a Cleric?

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47 minutes ago, Nyali-DN said:

Since I've been reading about staff vs. mace+shield. I've also been told to stick with my master BoS mace and shield, although I have a master BoS staff which I just got recently. What stones would you socket the mace and shield then? Full knowledge stones +10s just like the staff?

I'm currently running on a master cloth set as support on my cleric although I've also been told that I could just change the stones from HP to knowledge stones and I should be still good and use one set for support and DPS. Although I feel a bit uncomfy with this since I really love my HP +30k. What do you think? I mean I wouldn't mind to get a 2nd cloth set as a DPS, but tbh, it's a hell of a lot work and resources... 

 

The reason I said that you need a lot more Kinah for the dedicated DPS Staff is, that you need to enchant it to +20 and use Kn+9 Stones (only for the staff). Only then you will reach the MB cap in BoS/Open World pve

http://aion.mouseclic.com/tool/gearcalc/93827

However, you will gain >10% PvE attack, and even much more if you enchant further than +20.

So, as a conclusion, if you are willing to spend the kinah needed, you should make
1. a staff for dedicated DPS
2. a mace (+15)+shield(+15, for the extra block, helps with most non elite mobs that are a bit annoying at times) (with kn+7) for healing/DPS
(3. a mace(+0, +2 splendor of recovery if possible =))+shield(+15, for the extra block) (with HP) for the times that you really need more HP/Block (like when u want to train a lot of mobs for whatever reason))

If you don't want to enchant past +15, there is no real reason to get the double staff, though you could and replace the armors Kn7 with Kn 8-9. But thats no real jump in DPS compared to the above mentioned option

 

 

Edited by Decalcomania-KT

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Nyali-DN   
12 minutes ago, Decalcomania-KT said:

 

The reason I said that you need a lot more Kinah for the dedicated DPS Staff is, that you need to enchant it to +20 and use Kn+9 Stones (only for the staff). Only then you will reach the MB cap in BoS/Open World pve

http://aion.mouseclic.com/tool/gearcalc/93827

However, you will gain >10% PvE attack, and even much more if you enchant further than +20.

So, as a conclusion, if you are willing to spend the kinah needed, you should make
1. a staff for dedicated DPS
2. a mace (+15)+shield(+15, for the extra block, helps with most non elite mobs that are a bit annoying at times) (with kn+7) for healing/DPS
(3. a mace(+0, +2 splendor of recovery if possible =))+shield(+15, for the extra block) (with HP) for the times that you really need more HP/Block (like when u want to train a lot of mobs for whatever reason))

Thankies so much for summing it up for me! <3 I'm a bit overhelmed with all my gear right now. lol

Any opinions on getting an extra BoS set or just stick to one with knowledge stones in it? Not sure what the best HP pool is for end game, maybe 23-25k, guessing.

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9 minutes ago, Nyali-DN said:

Thankies so much for summing it up for me! <3 I'm a bit overhelmed with all my gear right now. lol

Any opinions on getting an extra BoS set or just stick to one with knowledge stones in it? Not sure what the best HP pool is for end game, maybe 23-25k, guessing.

 

You don't really need an extra BoS set. 25k HP coupled with +6 (or +7) gray wolf bottom accessories is more than enough to survive everything without a problem.

And if you feel uncomfortable at start, just use  the 3rd option for healing, until you are more comfortable with lower HP

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Nyali-DN   
10 minutes ago, Decalcomania-KT said:

You don't really need an extra BoS set. 25k HP coupled with +6 (or +7) gray wolf bottom accessories is more than enough to survive everything without a problem.

And if you feel uncomfortable at start, just use  the 3rd option for healing, until you are more comfortable with lower HP

I appreciate your advice, thankies! :3 I'll try to enchant my master gear now. Gonna cost me a lot. z.z

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1 hour ago, Decalcomania-KT said:

 

The reason I said that you need a lot more Kinah for the dedicated DPS Staff is, that you need to enchant it to +20 and use Kn+9 Stones (only for the staff). Only then you will reach the MB cap in BoS/Open World pve

 

 

Realistically speaking, for the majority of clers, when they go to BoS it's in healspec (where they should still contribute to dps switching sets and doing damage when heals aren't needed, ofc), and even when they go in dps spec, I'd say 99% of groups still do normal mode/easy mode, where not being stat capped isn't a big issue (people were beating normal/easy mode way before master harvester/grey wolf gear was released, so neither of them are necessary, though of course good to have), and success of the run it's mostly based on people not being retarded (moving out of hailstorm, not training AoE para on healers). 

Point being, that people still deciding between staff vs mace/shield shouldn't worry that much about BoS stats, when most instances (including FM) have a way lower MB cap, and for those instances they'd benefit more from the extra pve attack on the staff compared to an equivalent mace/shield combo, even at just +15.

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8 hours ago, Hinotori-KT said:

Realistically speaking, for the majority of clers, when they go to BoS it's in healspec (where they should still contribute to dps switching sets and doing damage when heals aren't needed, ofc), and even when they go in dps spec, I'd say 99% of groups still do normal mode/easy mode, where not being stat capped isn't a big issue (people were beating normal/easy mode way before master harvester/grey wolf gear was released, so neither of them are necessary, though of course good to have), and success of the run it's mostly based on people not being retarded (moving out of hailstorm, not training AoE para on healers). 

Point being, that people still deciding between staff vs mace/shield shouldn't worry that much about BoS stats, when most instances (including FM) have a way lower MB cap, and for those instances they'd benefit more from the extra pve attack on the staff compared to an equivalent mace/shield combo, even at just +15.

1. Realistically speaking it's best for the group if the cleric helps out with dps if he/she is not busy with healing. In most instances, with most groups that are geared enough to have master harvester gear, the cleric's are idling away their time >50% (except for maybe FM) of the runs. so realistically speaking, just because a majority of the clerics is runnign around with full heal spec and not dpsing, doesnt mean that realistically speaking its the only viable option nor the best. Maybe it would be the "best" if you are a sheep who cant think outside the box and doing what majority is doing without trying to better yourself and helping your group being better is considered the "best".

 

2. Idc if most people are stat capped or not, and why they can't reun BoS and what not. Nyali asked a specific question about MASTER HARVESTER GEAR, which is enough of a point to proof that he/she is running BoS so that the stat cap does matter.

 

3. So point being, it's totally legit for him/her trying to find a way to help his/her group doing things smoother, by not idling away their time and helping with dps. By the way on avg runs, while other dps might do 4-5mill dmg. Me as a hybrid cleric, healing SOLO my group in BoS, i can still deal 2mill dmg on endboss. Damage that others don't need to deal, damage thats helps with the run being smoother and faster. And I can do it without a dedicated HP set and I can do it without switching sets around all the time for no valid reason, other than "most people" thinking that you need a full HP set, because most other people said that.

Point being, why don't you keep your opinion to yourself, since you got nothing constructive to add.

Edited by Decalcomania-KT

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4 hours ago, Decalcomania-KT said:

1. Realistically speaking it's best for the group if the cleric helps out with dps if he/she is not busy with healing. In most instances, with most groups that are geared enough to have master harvester gear, the cleric's are idling away their time >50% (except for maybe FM) of the runs. so realistically speaking, just because a majority of the clerics is runnign around with full heal spec and not dpsing, doesnt mean that realistically speaking its the only viable option nor the best. Maybe it would be the "best" if you are a sheep who cant think outside the box and doing what majority is doing without trying to better yourself and helping your group being better is considered the "best".

I said on the very first sentence that even healspec clerics should help with dps, and that they should do it in dps gear, so you just wrote a textwall to repeat what I already said. Grats.

Quote

2. Idc if most people are stat capped or not, and why they can't reun BoS and what not. Nyali asked a specific question about MASTER HARVESTER GEAR, which is enough of a point to proof that he/she is running BoS so that the stat cap does matter.

My reason to bring up a dps set with non-capped stats (that is, non-capped for 1 instance, perfectly fine for everything else) is budget. Clerics, being one of the most expensive classes to gear up for pvp, unless they're rich, often have to prioritize some gear goals over others. So what are you gonna spend your limited resources on, a pve set for content that you could pass even with 65 gear, or your pvp gear so that you don't get literally 2 shot by any geared group? The answer doesn't need to be black and white, you can just make a pve dps set that is good enough to hold your ground as a dpser, but that doesn't break your wallet. For reference, I can do 1.4 ~ 1.8m damage in FM boss fight being the healspec cleric, using a pretty ghetto dps set (mix of +10 mythic ac armor and +15 pvp gear, +10 master harvester staff, +0 grey wolf accs, stats are around 5.2k mb / 3k ma / 900 cs with consumables/minion).

 

Quote

 

3. So point being, it's totally legit for him/her trying to find a way to help his/her group doing things smoother, by not idling away their time and helping with dps. By the way on avg runs, while other dps might do 4-5mill dmg. Me as a hybrid cleric, healing SOLO my group in BoS, i can still deal 2mill dmg on endboss. Damage that others don't need to deal, damage thats helps with the run being smoother and faster. And I can do it without a dedicated HP set and I can do it without switching sets around all the time for no valid reason, other than "most people" thinking that you need a full HP set, because most other people said that.

Point being, why don't you keep your opinion to yourself, since you got nothing constructive to add.

 


My mention to switching sets between healing/dps was in reference to an HB set (DD or Purified Hyperion with HB ancients, or coe/harvester/master harvester with regular hb+3s, 65 gear being much cheaper to enchant as it doesn't break and doesn't need omegas), which is a set you'll already have if you're serious about pvping, so it ties back into the topic of using the resources you already have (it's not like you'd make an hb set just for pve as pve content is easy enough, you can do it, but you don't need it), in the same way that you could reuse your pvp mb armor for pve if you didn't had a dedicated pve dps set, it's not optimal, but still heaps above wet-noodling mobs in an hb/hp set.

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6 hours ago, Hinotori-KT said:

1. I said on the very first sentence that even healspec clerics should help with dps, and that they should do it in dps gear, so you just wrote a textwall to repeat what I already said. Grats.

2. My reason to bring up a dps set with non-capped stats (that is, non-capped for 1 instance, perfectly fine for everything else) is budget. Clerics, being one of the most expensive classes to gear up for pvp, unless they're rich, often have to prioritize some gear goals over others. So what are you gonna spend your limited resources on, a pve set for content that you could pass even with 65 gear, or your pvp gear so that you don't get literally 2 shot by any geared group? The answer doesn't need to be black and white, you can just make a pve dps set that is good enough to hold your ground as a dpser, but that doesn't break your wallet. For reference, I can do 1.4 ~ 1.8m damage in FM boss fight being the healspec cleric, using a pretty ghetto dps set (mix of +10 mythic ac armor and +15 pvp gear, +10 master harvester staff, +0 grey wolf accs, stats are around 5.2k mb / 3k ma / 900 cs with consumables/minion).

3. My mention to switching sets between healing/dps was in reference to an HB set (DD or Purified Hyperion with HB ancients, or coe/harvester/master harvester with regular hb+3s, 65 gear being much cheaper to enchant as it doesn't break and doesn't need omegas), which is a set you'll already have if you're serious about pvping, so it ties back into the topic of using the resources you already have (it's not like you'd make an hb set just for pve as pve content is easy enough, you can do it, but you don't need it), in the same way that you could reuse your pvp mb armor for pve if you didn't had a dedicated pve dps set, it's not optimal, but still heaps above wet-noodling mobs in an hb/hp set.

1. You replied to 50% of the aspect brought up. The more important one being that full healspec is usually not needed. So you couldn't follow and process the textwall and thought I only repeated what you said. Grats.

2. Because Nyali asked specifically for master harvester gear. Nothing else to add. Even if you add more textwall.

3. HB set imho is pretty much useless. Even if you socket the whole set and weapon and shield with HB+3 stones, the max you can get is 12.3% increase of the base healvalue which is around ~400-600 HP  for the top tier healskills that is getting healed additionally (if you use outdated skills like healing light even way less). All at the cost of more useful things like damage. And if you use outdated DD or IS gear. well you know the difference in squishyness even if only compared to CoE.

 

And why all this talk about switching gears and having to prioritize gears. Let me repeat myself Nyali asked specifically for master harvester set. And master harvester gives you the perfect blend of being not squishy, having decent HB on the armor itself, and the more than viable option of not having to socket HP, which leaves you free to needing only 1 armor set for DPS and healing (with full knowledge). Having mace+shield for hybrid healing+dps is a matter of castspeed+a lil bit of extra protection from shield and getting the most efficient mix ouf of both worlds. Which is good enough for keeping up with dps of avg groups in pve-dps if you dont want to spend the extra kinah for staff

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I wholeheartedly agreed with you @Decalcomania-KT

Cleric shouldn't be focus just healing or dps only they should be able to do both and the only reason I would go for mace is cast speed.
@CosmoSkyMaster-KT just told me to weaving with smite and it's working greatly I hardly using call lightning and punishing earth.

I place Bene infront of my healing chain and place sac power in front of dps chain this way I can switch  effectlvely heal or dps.
It doesn't mean I totally rejected you @Hinotori-KT I understand your built goal is make highest dps as much as possible I can see that.

I'll buy Apollo chains and socket with knowledge stones.

Anyway thanks for reading cya :)

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