I report Aion for none stop kicking in evergale

[Zeyra-KT]

Yesterday I found myself in a place I dont want to be, I said to an Asmodian mate "reported". Why? Because he was kicking people none stop in evergale... sounds familiar? But it wasnt his fault. As soon as players see they dont have a leader or we get a match against shady groups or see we are loosing cuz so many players afk they start to ask to alliance leader to be kicked, by wisp, sometimes by alliance chat, then the rain of followers starts and the alliance chat becomes into a flood of "kick me please". Is insane. Is shameful. Is so sad we become this. But who to blame? The nice person that complied your "kick me" request? I think we all are and not. I blame NCWest and i report them. Yes. As a solution for player's base request Aion decided to activate the kicking tool, drop some not that clear rules and leave it to our fate and what happens next is what we all have lived till now. So after thinking a bit i decided to write this post and ask you guys to use forum to contribute with your evergale experience, maybe in this thread if you like, and a posible solution BUT before do that if you have been in the position of kicking players because they asked READ this and think:

Nobody likes to go in a quick entry and see themselves in a loosing evergale with the other faction overruning your rest and players afking. Because when you do the cool favour of kicking someone, someone else gets in, and is a loop of kick GG!!! Think like this, if we are loosing and nobody is moving just let the time run and it will be ended before you know, has no sence to do that to someone else and that person that scape the penalty will have to wait out because if they quick entry again they will just end in the same evergale... so meh

Things i saw in evergale that should have a solution:

    Kicking option is been abused should be stoped/paused
    1 player can start and alliance and go in by himself hijacking the league/alliance leader to obstruct with pvp strategics
    Masive disconnection happening from day 1
    Alliance leader afks dont pass lead to other (didnt we had in sieges coalition a timer that passed leadership to a higher rank?)

I bet is more and maybe is time we speak up and try to be constructive by flooding Aion with ideas.

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@Cyan I know you guys gave us this kicking option as a solution but is not working, I invite you to enter a few evergales and see what im talking about. Reporting afkers is not really working a see a lot of ppl still playing daily and some of them are this "kick me" flooders. Maybe a survey whit options of what NC can do or a post in forum asking for ideas. Evergale is such a good instance but is being ruined.

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Instead of asking for kick... why dont we ask for push?

[Bryos-DN]

If I ever got lead, and was losing, I would never kick anyone, as much as I am asked to do. When you join, you should accept who you are matched against and not be able to just bounce back and try again.

[Vantheria-DN]

I don't ever ask to be kicked from a (badly) losing alliance because I just go brush my teeth, use the restroom, let the dogs out, get a snack, etc and take my 25 GP lmao. I guess I can understand people wanting to be able to queue immediately into a potentially better alliance, but as @Bryos-DN said, you need to take what you get in most cases. If you're that upset about being in a losing alliance, you might need to take a break from Evergale for a little while.

[Kromede-KT]

Stop joining quick entry and form an alliance.  You can't force people to play how you want to.

[Zeyra-KT]

Well Chashu if i cant force people to play how i want to then i cant form an alliance (aka i suck at it :3). If instead of glancing my post you have really read you had realize Im not telling people what to do. Im asking Cyan to review the system because i dont think it works, and im asking the other unlucky players that dont have a leader to follow (like you do) to re-think they way of playing because is not only me the one that plays by quick entry and im not the only one that is tired of this new age where "kick me please" is socialy accepted. And im not the only one getting affected by it. Only that ppl dont dare to post what is happening because of ppl like you.

I would love that quick entry doesnt exists and we could only go by pre-made or not to go, because then maybe ppl would organize like you say. But for that I think Aion needs ideas and not only mine. Therefore this post.

[Kromede-KT]

Why drag it out? People want gear and it is expensive to recharge your augment, idian, food, scrolls, candy, minion, power shards, godstones for 0 reward. I don't blame them for wanting out on a losing ec.

[Vessttemona-KT]

10 hours ago, Bryos-DN said:

If I ever got lead, and was losing, I would never kick anyone, as much as I am asked to do. When you join, you should accept who you are matched against and not be able to just bounce back and try again.

I got the lead of an ally a few days ago, and even though we were losing by a difference of 1000 points, people start to ask me to kick them out, i told them i will not kick people and told them to stay and fight that we can still win the run or at least if we were to loose, we can still make it to 4000 points, even so people kept sending me messages to kick them out and i had to said that if anyone wants to leave, they can leave any time they want but i wasnt going to do it for them and that they all wanted to be in an run where they could get an easy win, that started a fire on me, they insulted me in so many ways in English, Spanish, Portuguese, and in a language that I still do not recognize which was. There was even one person who told me, that if I didn't kick him/her out of the instance, I'd be accused with my BG, and belive it or not, this person did it .

Anyway, I think a solution to this problem would be to add a time of punishment, like the one we have when we leave the instance on our own

[Bryos-DN]

The flames give me strength!

The deal is, it is also a bit selfish to ask to be kicked. If you do get kicked, you will also leave a place, and another person queued up will take it up. That person will also end up in a failed Evergale group just as you did, because you couldnt wait a couple of minutes.

49 minutes ago, Vessttemona-KT said:

Anyway, I think a solution to this problem would be to add a time of punishment, like the one we have when we leave the instance on our own

Honestly, that would just be worse. Then those who got unfairly kicked will have to endure that punishment for no reason. The way I see it, the only two solutions would be to go back to not being able to kick anyone at all, or we all deal with these "kickee wannabes" in our own way. (And if you get flamed for it, then even better!)

[Kailor-DN]

I agree, self policing is best here. We need an Evergale "Kick Happy Loosers" thread pinned on the forums, find one WHEN you are a leader that asks to be kicked on a loosing team, post the character name. Learn the names that come up over and over, you lead, you get one of the repeaters posted, you kick IMMEDIATELY - no play for them. Soon those folks won't be allowed in a group at all and, those that will play it out, even loosing will have places in the alliances going in.

 

Sure we all want the rewards, it costs to power up for it and, a loss/ no reward sucks but, that's the game, you aren't going to win every single time you go in. Deal with it, fight through, take the loss, eat it and, keep it enjoyable for everyone instead of making it a kick fest.

[Nyali-DN]

1 hour ago, Kadeth-KT said:

I agree, self policing is best here. We need an Evergale "Kick Happy Loosers" thread pinned on the forums, find one WHEN you are a leader that asks to be kicked on a loosing team, post the character name. Learn the names that come up over and over, you lead, you get one of the repeaters posted, you kick IMMEDIATELY - no play for them. Soon those folks won't be allowed in a group at all and, those that will play it out, even loosing will have places in the alliances going in.

Isn't this a bit too radical?  I mean I understand that people are being silly and want to get kicked, but it should be up to NCWest to fix this issue since obviously the instance is not suppose to work this way. Also if you start kicking people out of your alliance, wouldn't the guideline rules apply for kicking? Sounds like a grey area to me.

[Vantheria-DN]

1 hour ago, Kadeth-KT said:

you get one of the repeaters posted, you kick IMMEDIATELY - no play for them.

I wouldn't recommend doing this or you could get a slap on the wrist or even a 3-day ban. Cyan has already stated that if people are kicked without a reason, they can create a ticket to report the person who kicked them. If you kick someone and they haven't actually done anything wrong *in that instance* then that is kicking them without a reason.

[Rapier-DN]

6 hours ago, Vessttemona-KT said:

I got the lead of an ally a few days ago, and even though we were losing by a difference of 1000 points, people start to ask me to kick them out, i told them i will not kick people and told them to stay and fight that we can still win the run or at least if we were to loose, we can still make it to 4000 points, even so people kept sending me messages to kick them out and i had to said that if anyone wants to leave, they can leave any time they want but i wasnt going to do it for them and that they all wanted to be in an run where they could get an easy win, that started a fire on me, they insulted me in so many ways in English, Spanish, Portuguese, and in a language that I still do not recognize which was. There was even one person who told me, that if I didn't kick him/her out of the instance, I'd be accused with my BG, and belive it or not, this person did it .

Anyway, I think a solution to this problem would be to add a time of punishment, like the one we have when we leave the instance on our own

People will usually start to afk if they don't see the lead that they want, or even if the score is down by a couple of hundred points. If someone starts begging for being kicked without any attempt, I will tell them that no one is holding them there, they are free to leave. The sole exception is if someone asks if the zone in at the very last minute, although I will tell them that they're better off waiting the minute or so for the instance to end at that point.

5 hours ago, Bryos-DN said:

The flames give me strength!

The deal is, it is also a bit selfish to ask to be kicked. If you do get kicked, you will also leave a place, and another person queued up will take it up. That person will also end up in a failed Evergale group just as you did, because you couldnt wait a couple of minutes.

Honestly, that would just be worse. Then those who got unfairly kicked will have to endure that punishment for no reason. The way I see it, the only two solutions would be to go back to not being able to kick anyone at all, or we all deal with these "kickee wannabes" in our own way. (And if you get flamed for it, then even better!)

It is selfish, I don't think these players realize that they agree to join a group instance, not a solo instance, and that their actions affect other players. If I have lead and kick anyone, I always provide warnings and check what they are doing. Even so:

-. I have kicked someone then been threatened with having everyone in my legion being kicked by someone who was unhappy with having their friend kicked.

-I have been  revenge kicked  after kicking someone who was clearly AFK and was warned multiple times.

People have complained about the ready checks. Funny though, the last person who complained the loudest was themselves more than one EC and they were needed for support. They went AFK since they saw a premade as league leader - since they aren't needed in that case. Well if anyone else uses that bright logic, we won a match by only 25 points yesterday.

22 minutes ago, Nyali-DN said:

Isn't this a bit too radical?  I mean I understand that people are being silly and want to get kicked, but it should be up to NCWest to fix this issue since obviously the instance is not suppose to work this way. Also if you start kicking people out of your alliance, wouldn't the guideline rules apply for kicking? Sounds like a grey area to me.

No, it isn't up to NCWest, it is up to us. For one thing, if you expect a software solution, that requires time and resources. You don't know if they have the resources (i.e development staff) IF they agree to make changes, OR how long it will take, OR if any change would be better .

This is a community issue. The community should to decide on how to deal with players that expect to be carried, that don't want to follow basic instructions, that don't have any PVP, that will go AFK with lead. Example-  if someone repeatedly goes afk with lead in EC, don't invite him to your groups, or get the legion officers involved, etc.

 

[Zeyra-KT]

3 hours ago, Rapier-DN said:

No, it isn't up to NCWest, it is up to us. For one thing, if you expect a software solution, that requires time and resources. You don't know if they have the resources (i.e development staff) IF they agree to make changes, OR how long it will take, OR if any change would be better .

This is a community issue. The community should to decide on how to deal with players that expect to be carried, that don't want to follow basic instructions, that don't have any PVP, that will go AFK with lead. Example-  if someone repeatedly goes afk with lead in EC, don't invite him to your groups, or get the legion officers involved, etc.

I agree it might seems like is a waste of time but for other reasons tho in severals Cyan's posts he tell us he is going to talk to devs to see if it can be changed, the most recent is the Daeva Dash Event thread, if you check it they are promesing many changes and fixs, so if they are wasting their time for an Event how come they cant use a bit of a time for an instance that is every day? That leads me to belive that they can, with ideas and experiences given by us.

Many not known players have been trying to lead the "quick entry" players but sometimes they fail in something that is beyond talking with the comunity to change their ways, that I also agree is part up to us. And is because system let lvl 66 (alt form the other faction) be the leader of the league/ally as I said before and that discourage to players to push or lead. That is the kind of things I think they should fix or as I read in another thread "if someone is kick by afking then also should have a penalty" so that would end with the lazys asking for kick and more.

[Rapier-DN]

@Zeyra-KT that's a very interesting point about seeing a low-level in an alliance lead. As you say, that can either be an alt that is holding lead for the purpose of blocking the match - (how pathetic is that, when you think about it). It could also legitimately be someone who is new and doesn't know how to pass lead . Sounds funny, but a league leader kicked a whole alliance recently by mistake, was easy enough to do they definitely knew how to do, imagine how confused a new person can be.

However, as annoying as it is, if you happen to see the same low level pull the same stupid stunt then all that we can do is report them. If enough people do it, then there is no way that support will ignore the issue.

[Toma-KT]

They should add cd to the kick option like 1-2min.

[Bryos-DN]

2 minutes means nothing. It is what it takes an Evergale run to begin. 10 minutes cd means missing a run, 1 hour cd means losing much more.

[Toma-KT]

Im talking about inside of EC so leader cant kick all thoses players asking for kicks to queue again.

[Amarah-KT]

I usually do quick entry.  Glutton for punishment, yes I know.   Not everyone wants to lead and alliance, and the brave souls who do tend to invite people they know and trust.  Seriously no shame in that, it just perpetuates the culture where some people I have met dont even know the objectives because the only thing worth typing is flaming each other.  Even if you get lucky enough to tag into one of the additional alliances not all leaders talk across league.  Of course there is always that one guy who assumes they know best and people should just follow them but lets be real..  there needs to be some communication.   These are cross server and I dont know them any more than they know me.    There are things players CAN DO right now to make it better for everyone.  Even without lead I appreciate someone sharing the plan so I dont have to hope I picked the right person to follow.  While I love me a good temp, Ive been lead to some embarrassing deaths lol!     There have been several times where my pop leads me into and EC where the score is already 4K+ to nothing.    Honesty I think there should be a cutoff of allowing more players to enter.   For both the winning team and the losing team.  Like dredge.  I have seen several players ask to be kicked only to rejoin the same alliance moments later.   It seems like the instance is constantly in fill mode regardless of how much time is left.   Sure you got 25 GP for no effort but where's the fun in that?

[Arhangelos]

Best solution is to remove the cool down on leaving from EC. think about it, people keep asking to be kicked to re-queue fast, so that does the trick most of the times.

Simply remove the penalty, nobody will complain, nobody will ask for a kick, nobody will have a problem with you leaving the game in a losing match and nobody will hate the bad algorithm that got you into a losing fight with the enemies being 3k points ahead and inside our base killing everyone.

And probably the best solution is ---> STOP putting players into EC when the game started like 10 minutes ago, what is the point of entering EC like 10~15 minutes after it started or even later? We do not have the option for "new personal entry" only quick entry which means it will put you in a fight even 1 minute before it ends.

Another solution, literally give another option for people to make 4 alliances and then apply for it as a whole. YES it would take them a lot of time to enter but that would be their choice. I have seen pre-made matches take so long both to form and pop but it is their choice because they'd rather wait and win for sure than to quick enter and keep losing.

[Mirelium-KT]

well i have given a lot of thought into EC entry system(here is the real problem in my opinion, since most players ask to get kicked when there is no premade alli that leads).. and one of the solutions, if you ask me is this: 1 battlefield can be opened only by 2 premade full alliance (1 asmo and 1 ely), after which the rest of the alliance from league are formed by quick entry players. Downside to this, each EC would be a more intense experience. Would probably eliminate or decrease a lot the "easy win" battles. 
just an idea  What do you guys think?

[Arhangelos]

3 hours ago, Mirelium-KT said:

well i have given a lot of thought into EC entry system(here is the real problem in my opinion, since most players ask to get kicked when there is no premade alli that leads).. and one of the solutions, if you ask me is this: 1 battlefield can be opened only by 2 premade full alliance (1 asmo and 1 ely), after which the rest of the alliance from league are formed by quick entry players. Downside to this, each EC would be a more intense experience. Would probably eliminate or decrease a lot the "easy win" battles. 
just an idea  What do you guys think?

But in this case if there is no premade it would never open? I wouldn't mind favoring the teaming of 1 premade from one side to another premade from the other side IF both sides had a premade forming at the same time. Otherwise people would stop forming premades and it would end up nothing but luck based instance.

We can all agree that "fixing" an instance's entry algortihm with so many people in it in a server that is dieing wouldn't work easily because of numbers.

~~

For now they could literally remove the re-entry penalty.

[Azzmaria-KT]

On 30/4/2018 at 4:12 PM, Arxaggelos-KT said:

Best solution is to remove the cool down on leaving from EC. think about it, people keep asking to be kicked to re-queue fast, so that does the trick most of the times.

Simply remove the penalty, nobody will complain, nobody will ask for a kick, nobody will have a problem with you leaving the game in a losing match and nobody will hate the bad algorithm that got you into a losing fight with the enemies being 3k points ahead and inside our base killing everyone.

And probably the best solution is ---> STOP putting players into EC when the game started like 10 minutes ago, what is the point of entering EC like 10~15 minutes after it started or even later? We do not have the option for "new personal entry" only quick entry which means it will put you in a fight even 1 minute before it ends.

Another solution, literally give another option for people to make 4 alliances and then apply for it as a whole. YES it would take them a lot of time to enter but that would be their choice. I have seen pre-made matches take so long both to form and pop but it is their choice because they'd rather wait and win for sure than to quick enter and keep losing.

those can work.

or even to modify EC to be just a 24v24 players instance. Not sure how hard that can be, but I guess 24 is still a good number to play that instance, and in that way could be posible to create your  own groups with people AFK or NO AFK. 

also, I saw in other instances that after certain time, nobody else can join the team. Maybe EC can have something like that, and the league can be "closed" after 30 secs or 1 min after the start so nobody else can join it. Just like Arxanggelos said, I do not see the point to let people join after 5 mins. 

[Arhangelos]

41 minutes ago, Azzmaria-KT said:

those can work.

or even to modify EC to be just a 24v24 players instance. Not sure how hard that can be, but I guess 24 is still a good number to play that instance, and in that way could be posible to create your  own groups with people AFK or NO AFK. 

also, I saw in other instances that after certain time, nobody else can join the team. Maybe EC can have something like that, and the league can be "closed" after 30 secs or 1 min after the start so nobody else can join it. Just like Arxanggelos said, I do not see the point to let people join after 5 mins. 

I think 24 people for that instance is way too little because you need 1 group to kill one boss and 2 groups just to kill it on time. Wouldn't it turn into a ninja instance where people who try to run around keeping camps and trying to pve?

The instance stops including new players when a newer instance is open and still has slots, I could be wrong.
I saw people entering EC about 20 minutes later or something.

~~~~~

I agree, entering EC should be open the first 2 minutes when the timer is still red and maybe another 5 minutes max. Otherwise never start an instance with just 1 alliance and then 10 minutes later put in more alliances, they are screwing the rest of the alliances this way or simply allow them to be carried.

[Jacque-KT]

Ok, I have read most all of these post.......... and while there is good discussion, this also opens up many other doors as well, depending on the prospective.........in short, there are too many double standards..... first, I am a novice player with limited resources........... but that is my choice and it is also my right to do so......I do not in fact think it is fair to kick anyone for any reason in EC... why? yes you have slackers, so what................. but there are also people like me who are trying but are way under geared or maybe not enough Dram or other reasons..... sometimes bloom gets so bad I have to just stop and let it catch up.......... but how else can one learn or get better... people like me need the experience to get better...however the double standard comes in not only in EC but in most all instances ...... the upper classes and bigger legions want all the points and all the glory and in most cases just do not help the lesser players.. and so, you have players who get discouraged and figure the only way they can progress is to afk..........but that is just one side of it... most importantly...... this is just a Game and Not Real Life.............. and if you want to know the truth.......... the reason Elys win more often is because they help each other, their leaders, LEAD....they are more organized........... I have seen a thousand asmos at the Gate... by the time they got to the middle they are so separated it is ridiculous..every one has their own agenda................... and you want to kick players????? you need to remember that this Game is designed to make NC Soft Money...... not us but them ...but I do agree with one thing.......... if there is going to be a Kick agenda, it needs to be better organized, more clear, and more tightly controlled........and that is the Provence of NC SOFT...... when I enter EC, I quick entry because it is the only way I can get in..... and If I am Captain, I immediately pass it to a higher level...................... and lastly, remember this................ EVERYBODY in this game spends real money at some point........and if they  want to afk, then they most likely have PAID for the right to do so.

[Arhangelos]

On 6/5/2018 at 2:20 AM, Jacque-KT said:

you have players who get discouraged and figure the only way they can progress is to afk

...this is where you stop the bs please. Just read what you wrote and take a moment to realize how stupid that sounds.

NOBODY will kick you for being undergeared or for dieing, you could go to the pve group since it is easier to help there than get ganged easily at pvp. You said you want and try to learn, does afk help you on that too?

The elyos dominate because they have 3x the number of asmodians at least in Katalam, this is why the whole abyss is green. There was a day that I had 13/13 wins on EC and I am an asmodian-KT because we had the luck to be in a premade and the rest of the people either followed, or if they were afk, they got kicked so active players could join.

If you want to afk you can't expect a whole league to be dragged behind so we all get the losing rewards because you think it is your right to afk. Kicking afkers is the reason we win EC in the asmodian side. The moment an afker is kicked, another player gets the slot, who can either be afk or active, we re-check and re-kick if needed.

~~

If you care to dress up you should be active, helping a league to win. Afking in EC will give you some sh!tty rewards that don't even worth afking for.