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Commander Soulstones... from pve?


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With so many outdated pvp instances why do we have Frozen Monolith, a pve instance, giving soulstones to upgrade pvp gear?

Evergale Canyon seems a reasonable thing since it is a pvp instance. BUT you can get 5x soulstones from Frozen Monolith and with 4 entries per week that is 20 soul stones. (Unless I heard wrongly about the numbers)

How about we got 1 soul  stone instead from every winning pvp instance, EOB, OW, IDL... heck even Dredgion has pvp along with the pve aspect. Even a winning siege could be more reasonable to give you a soul stone.

All of these don't have to give soul stones because then it would be "too easy" to get the upgrades (as if it is a bad thing), but what I am saying is that pvp instances should give soul stones instead of the pve instances.

Frozen monolith should give soul stones to upgrade pve gear.

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I suppose the deal with Frozen Monolith is that it is difficult (kind of, you need to be fairly well geared for it). So in order to make people interested on spamming it, to give them something to do or so others cam get people to complete their campaigns, they added incentives as rewards; Soulstones (and other stuff, but mainly those). Truth is, getting PvP stuff from PvE has been a thing since the first days, such as using Bakarma's/Triroan's/Lannok's extendies, Fortress Instances, PvE-only Eye. Personally, I am fine with it, because I want the Abyss gear for its appearance only, just so I have another option other than PvPing, but I can see PvP heroes complaining. It would have been nice to have soulstones on OW, IDL, KBF and IWW (not in ID/EOB, considering that Archdaevas cannot enter them). It would make those instances more popular other than just GP-farming. But it is what it is.

6.0 made it clear Devs want to split PvE and PvP gear acquisition into its respective activities anyway, considering it was one of their objectives.

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28 minutes ago, Bryos-DN said:

I suppose the deal with Frozen Monolith is that it is difficult (kind of, you need to be fairly well geared for it). So in order to make people interested on spamming it, to give them something to do or so others cam get people to complete their campaigns, they added incentives as rewards; Soulstones (and other stuff, but mainly those). Truth is, getting PvP stuff from PvE has been a thing since the first days, such as using Bakarma's/Triroan's/Lannok's extendies, Fortress Instances, PvE-only Eye. Personally, I am fine with it, because I want the Abyss gear for its appearance only, just so I have another option other than PvPing, but I can see PvP heroes complaining. It would have been nice to have soulstones on OW, IDL, KBF and IWW (not in ID/EOB, considering that Archdaevas cannot enter them). It would make those instances more popular other than just GP-farming. But it is what it is.

6.0 made it clear Devs want to split PvE and PvP gear acquisition into its respective activities anyway, considering it was one of their objectives.

This is why it makes no sense at all to have so many PVP soulstones rewarded from a PVE instance, whereas a PVP instance such as IWW with a very limited number of  CDs  has not been updated, and an endgame PVP instance (EC) rewards  a fairly low number. 

No need by the way for the implied  denigration by the inclusion  of the "heroes" , that was unnecessary.No one has been making (or needs to)  make any judgement on whether PVE or PVP is better.

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42 minutes ago, Rapier-DN said:

This is why it makes no sense at all to have so many PVP soulstones rewarded from a PVE instance, whereas a PVP instance such as IWW with a very limited number of  CDs  has not been updated, and an endgame PVP instance (EC) rewards  a fairly low number. 

Why me wanting it as skin has anything to do? Not getting the idea you are sharing.

And it is not that bad. Evergale Canyon gives you 28 soulstones per week, FM gives you 15 or 25. Not to mention, 1 soulstone you dont need is better than 5 you dont need. Success in both instances is mainly luck. And in Evergale you can make up for the days you are too busy to run it by hoarding artifact fragments.

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The thing is pretty simple though. A PVE instance giving so much wanted rewards for pvp. Like back in the days of GP and TEB (The Eternal Bastion) where people would get high ranking by doing 10x TEB per day... zero pvp and still got ahead in ranks, while doing pvp gave you practically no GP.

I am trying to upgrade my items and since I cannot go to Frozen monolith, because although end game pve dressed, this requires a static group to do and I don't have one, I can only rely on EC, 4 soul stones per day, that means 6~7 months worth of farming EC on a daily basis just to do the items.

Also with the broken mechanics of EC you might wanna farm it for 3 hours to get at least 4 times the quest. More than half the times, a quick queue gets you into a losing EC where the enemies are in the base killing everyone, the other times you are in before the timer starts, you get a ton of afkers that ruin it and some times you might get either on a premade or in a quick queue that got you in a second alliance with a premade alliance. With this being said, you might get 4k points once per hour and that is not even enough to get the quest 4 times done.

~~~
I am not asking to make it easy to get the soul stones, but make it right. Make people pvp to get the pvp needed items.

Edited by Arxaggelos-KT
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2 minutes ago, Arxaggelos-KT said:

The thing is pretty simple though. A PVE instance giving so much wanted rewards for pvp. Like back in the days of GP and TEB (The Eternal Bastion) where people would get high ranking by doing 10x TEB per day... zero pvp and still got ahead in ranks, while doing pvp gave you practically no GP.

I am trying to upgrade my items and since I cannot go to Frozen monolith, because although end game pve dressed, this requires a static group to do and I don't have one, I can only rely on EC, 4 soul stones per day, that means 6~7 months worth of farming EC on a daily basis just to do the items.

Also with the broken mechanics of EC you might wanna farm it for 3 hours to get at least 4 times the quest. More than half the times, a quick queue gets you into a losing EC where the enemies are in the base killing everyone, the other times you are in before the timer starts, you get a ton of afkers that ruin it and some times you might get either on a premade or in a quick queue that got you in a second alliance with a premade alliance.

~~~
I am not asking to make it easy to get the soul stones, but make it right. Make people pvp to get the pvp needed items.

Agreed, I think that there is the assumption that everyone gets the full number of EC soulstones per week - not everyone does,  for the reasons that you listed above, even if there ae in a pre-made alliance, the other alliances maybe full of afkers. 

Many people that are geared have never run FM  either due to people only running in pre-mades or being extremely, extremely risk-averse. It doesn't help that there are often communication issues.

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Fine, but we are not talking about what "may happen" , we are better off discussing what "can happen". As I said before, both instances are luck. Just as you dont manage to win in EC enough, you can fail FM too. You get unlucky with different shield mechanics, your team/static is low dps, Nergal bugs and rages. And, like your case, some cannot even go in.

Again, I am not saying you are wrong to complain, being a fair point. But it is not as bad as you implied.

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 It's a PVE instance which gives rewards that are equivalent to a PVP instance. That's a poor game design that is reflected in the direction the game takes in 6.0.

And it is as bad as OP states, and since the main objective of the EC instance is to reward PVP players.  I have never seen NCSoft ever describe FM as a PVP instance, the instance rewards should reflect that.

Otherwise, I'm sure that there are players that can benefit from the soulstones that grind hard in EC but don't get them but need them for PVP - and players who get them and basically wastes a limited resource by getting  them via FM since they never PVP.

 Before you say "but you can't force anyone to play like you want", I agree completely, I would say to people to get ready for 6.0 though.

 

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Another reason I "complained" is that if we get the enchant event again, I will not have my accessories upgraded yet to be able to raise them high on temperings. I already did my weapon and it took me more than one month, it sure worth it. But I just wanted th game to give me plenty of chances to be able to get soul stones, other than going in EC and hoping not to get in with afkers or against a lethal premade enemy entry.

And trust me, if I could go to Frozen Monolith I would, I have very good pve items (like Graywolf +6/+7 etc and a good harvester weapon). It is just that this instance is only for a few and all the people I know are like 70 lvl and not even dressed enough.

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58 minutes ago, Ele-DN said:

Remember when EB was the only way to gear up and 90% of the players couldn't do it?

 

1- EB was never the only way to gear up.

2- People take some time to get oriented on the map as well as the various roles, veteran players don't always take that into account when someone is new to the instance. That can cause a lot of the problems.

 

 

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8 hours ago, Arxaggelos-KT said:

With so many outdated pvp instances why do we have Frozen Monolith, a pve instance, giving soulstones to upgrade pvp gear?

Evergale Canyon seems a reasonable thing since it is a pvp instance. BUT you can get 5x soulstones from Frozen Monolith and with 4 entries per week that is 20 soul stones. (Unless I heard wrongly about the numbers)
 

 

2 hours ago, Arxaggelos-KT said:

And trust me, if I could go to Frozen Monolith I would, I have very good pve items (like Graywolf +6/+7 etc and a good harvester weapon). It is just that this instance is only for a few and all the people I know are like 70 lvl and not even dressed enough.

 

And here we got the real reason for the "complaint".

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On ‎4‎/‎27‎/‎2018 at 8:55 AM, Arxaggelos-KT said:

With so many outdated pvp instances why do we have Frozen Monolith, a pve instance, giving soulstones to upgrade pvp gear?

Evergale Canyon seems a reasonable thing since it is a pvp instance. BUT you can get 5x soulstones from Frozen Monolith and with 4 entries per week that is 20 soul stones. (Unless I heard wrongly about the numbers)

How about we got 1 soul  stone instead from every winning pvp instance, EOB, OW, IDL... heck even Dredgion has pvp along with the pve aspect. Even a winning siege could be more reasonable to give you a soul stone.

All of these don't have to give soul stones because then it would be "too easy" to get the upgrades (as if it is a bad thing), but what I am saying is that pvp instances should give soul stones instead of the pve instances.

Frozen monolith should give soul stones to upgrade pve gear.

Why some noob who obvious hasn't even run the instance complaining about it?  Seriously stfu with all the whining and complaining.  Go spam your BOS.

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I like how ppl mention how this instance is for statics and what not. Ok it's PvE instance that gives pvp gear upgrades while every single material that is needed for the pvp gear is pve anyways and who stops you from forming your own "static" FM runs? 

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9 hours ago, Gabe-DN said:

Why some noob who obvious hasn't even run the instance complaining about it?  Seriously stfu with all the whining and complaining.  Go spam your BOS.

I wouldn't expect an intellectual amoeba like you to understand the case. I haven't run FM but this is not the case, my case is that I am doing PVP instances and I do not see soul stones there, while they put soul stones in pve instances. People doing pve shouldn't get rewarded with pvp stuff.

P.S. I never did BOS either, why would I bother with BOS when it is  a pve instance and it gives pve rewards? I don't do pve and this is the biggest reason I never did FM, and the only reason I ever mentioned it is because it gives pvp rewards that I am interested in. I don't care about the pve rewards or the pve instances.

Go do your pve you pve-hero and gtfo of pvp conversations.

If you still don't get it, I could make a drawing.

7 hours ago, Woo-DN said:

I like how ppl mention how this instance is for statics and what not. Ok it's PvE instance that gives pvp gear upgrades while every single material that is needed for the pvp gear is pve anyways and who stops you from forming your own "static" FM runs? 

I can make a static to go there, but will that change the fact that FM is a pve instance giving pvp rewards while pvp instances don't?

Please re-read the topic, re-read what you wrote and take your nonsense somewhere else.

On 28/4/2018 at 3:05 AM, Decalcomania-KT said:

 

And here we got the real reason for the "complaint".

...my complaint is that a pve instance gives pvp rewards. If I ever have to do a pve instance it will be because of the pvp rewards it shouldn't give, but gives them.

I haven't done 90% of the instances in this game because I don't do pve isntances. FM is one of them but they are forcing us to go there to upgrade our pvp gear because instead of putting pvp rewards in pvp instances, they decided to put them in pve instances.

I don't want to do FM, I would do it because it gives soul stones and I haven't done it because my friends are all 70~73 and without gear and I am the only one 75 lvl with gray wolf +7 and good items and manastones.

As a char I have the stats to go everywhere, I "can't do it" because my friends are not dressed for it yet and I don't remember complaining that my friends cannot come with me.

I shouldn't even know the existence of FM, because it is not a pve instance and I shouldn't even have to take it into consideration for my pvp.

Edited by Arxaggelos-KT
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7 hours ago, Woo-DN said:

I like how ppl mention how this instance is for statics and what not. Ok it's PvE instance that gives pvp gear upgrades while every single material that is needed for the pvp gear is pve anyways and who stops you from forming your own "static" FM runs? 

You missed the point completely. The issue is that it's a PVE instance that is more rewarding for PVP gear enhancement than PVP instances. 

That doesn't make sense.

 

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Aion has always been a game that required you to PvE to PvP. You needed it to get large amounts of AP, GP, medals, enchantment stones, omegas, temperings, kinah to enchant, etc.pp. And don't tell me you just suddenly became aware of it, now that you can't find a group to run FM with.

Compared to the old days, where you had to hardcore grind barracks for a few goblets (and there were no statues back then) and the rest of the time kill mobs that give like 50 AP/each for months, to get your AP gear, there is no real reason for you to cry over the times that you need to finish some simple FM runs.

Edited by Decalcomania-KT
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As @Bryos-DN pointed out, Aion has had a long history of giving PvP rewards from PvE instances. BUT.. it has been stated several times recently that the game is making a focused effort to move away from that. That's why the GP was removed from IS and EB and all the rest. The fact that after making the statement that PvP rewards will come from PvP instances and PvE rewards from PvE instances and then put PvP rewards in a brand new PvE instance is really nuts.

Then again.. Aion.

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4 hours ago, Decalcomania-KT said:

Aion has always been a game that required you to PvE to PvP. You needed it to get large amounts of AP, GP, medals, enchantment stones, omegas, temperings, kinah to enchant, etc.pp. And don't tell me you just suddenly became aware of it, now that you can't find a group to run FM with.

Compared to the old days, where you had to hardcore grind barracks for a few goblets (and there were no statues back then) and the rest of the time kill mobs that give like 50 AP/each for months, to get your AP gear, there is no real reason for you to cry over the times that you need to finish some simple FM runs.

And here is a post about yet another pve instance giving amazing rewards for pvp. We call them out on these things hoping they fix them.

I do not want to have to do Frozen Monolith. I hope in 6.0 they do their deal and totally separate pvp with pve

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Excuse me, you lost all credibility, because of the above mentioned points.

 

Aion has always been like this: needing PvE to PvP. Just it was (almost) never an high-end instance that gave you the items needed. It was usually an instance that most people could manage somehow (like for evergales). That's not the case for FM. You cant beat FM with PUGs (usually) and you can't beat it average/casual people because you lack the burst for the Pelida/Ascension double spawn or the coordination.

So how come you only mention FM??? How come you don't complain that you get omegas, temperings, kinah etc.pp. all the stuff you need in huge amounts for PvP and that you don't get from pvp? 

I tell you why: because you can manage to get those somehow from PvE. But you can't manage FM and THATS the only reason you complain here.

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5 hours ago, Decalcomania-KT said:

Excuse me, you lost all credibility, because of the above mentioned points.

 

Aion has always been like this: needing PvE to PvP. Just it was (almost) never an high-end instance that gave you the items needed. It was usually an instance that most people could manage somehow (like for evergales). That's not the case for FM. You cant beat FM with PUGs (usually) and you can't beat it average/casual people because you lack the burst for the Pelida/Ascension double spawn or the coordination.

So how come you only mention FM??? How come you don't complain that you get omegas, temperings, kinah etc.pp. all the stuff you need in huge amounts for PvP and that you don't get from pvp? 

I tell you why: because you can manage to get those somehow from PvE. But you can't manage FM and THATS the only reason you complain here.

Your comparison to the old days of grinding abyss forts to get PVP became invalid once Aion changed its game design to introduce PVE and PVP instances, a very long time ago. Up until then, it was absolutely true, the fastest way to get PVP gear was via the forts (PVE).

However, as now more than one person has pointed out, the instances that  give PVP rewards in PVE instances (GP) have had adjustments (GP removed) to reflect the game design i.e. PVE instance = PVE rewards, PVP instance = PVP rewards.

Foe PVP players, it is a matter of fairness that this is also adjusted in FM, as was done in other instances, in this specific case it's for purification mats. Either remove it, or adjust it so that only 1 drops instead of a bundle  - that would be much fairer.

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