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Brutallus-DN

Something needs to be done about PvE

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THE ISSUE

tl:dr at bottom

Since the update, PvE has been very unrewarding and very luck dependent. The instances themselves are fine (boss mechanics, difficulty etc) but the loot is a major problem. Primeth’s Forge (PF, 6 people) and Infernal Drakenspire Depths (IDD, 12 people), the only instances that can drop PvE ultimate gear, have a CHANCE to drop said gear (I’m not sure of the exact %, but it is definitely too low). I don’t understand NC’s logic behind this, as all instances in the past always dropped something.

Primeth’s Forge

Me and my static group have done PF every week (4 runs, total amount is around 48 runs) and so far, there has been:

1 (!) ultimate cloth

3 ultimate leather

2 ultimate chain (the first 2 runs)

5 ultimate plate

Our group composition is not the best for sure, but the drops above are plain stupid. We had to do over 20 runs for just 1 ultimate drop, how infuriating is that?

What can be done?

Copying off 5.1-5.3 CoE mechanics (particles dropped from bosses, traded said particles for end game gear), why can’t this be the same with PF (with untradeable particles to block abusing alts)? 1 particle for each member in the group, need 7 or so particles for pauldrons/gloves/shoes, 8 for leggings, 9 for tunic, and 10 for wings/plume/bracelet. This way, it still has that “hard work” feeling to it, while not making the person feel like they’re running to get disappointed, as they’re working towards something.

Infernal Drakenspire Depths

This one is MORE dumb, because there are 12 people (usually) each run, since IDD

drops accessories/weapons, even with a “perfect” alliance (1 person/class, one class would have to have 2 people) 6 people will roll for a physical accessory, 6 people will roll for a magic accessory (if it drops, of course). Many people now do 6 man IDD (better chance at rolling), and my friend only has 2 IDD pieces (1 was handed to her), while she has been doing 6 man IDD for 10-15 runs.

What can be done?

Pre 6.0, Drakenspire Depths dropped 1 box for each person in the alliance, which either had a mythic (ultimate in 6.2) or eternal (legendary in 6.2) item, for the said persons class. Why can’t this be the same thing for IDD? Everyone gets something, and at least you won’t have to roll against your friends.

tldr: PvE looting sucks right now, you can:

PF: Add particles at final boss loot, 1 for each person, they trade particles for ultimate gear

IDD: Old DD loot mechanic

@Cyan I am expecting an answer for this

Edited by Brutallus-DN

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Maybe a nice improvement can be do in those instance like we had in the past with instances like Tiamat Stronghold. In that instance every boss had a chance to drop something. And we had 7 of them. So the average was like 2-3 eternal items each run. All of them to be rolled between the players. In those instances each boss has a chance for some type of item. Some gave boots, others gave weapons... So at the end was a RNG thing, but still with more items at the end. 

But maybe the other problem here is that we have so few options now. The game is really small. Back on 3.X we had 2 endgame gears from instaces (TS and Forest-Manor), 1 gear from tokens (kahrun), 1 from craft and 1 Daevanion. All of them good ones and with some small differences.  Now we only have 1 from instances and 1 crafted (and the crafted one can not be tuned and is not so good). 

I think we just need more content. Like more maps and more instances and some new coins, maybe more crafts.... mmmm... well we need all the erased content back maybe xD

 

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Ele-DN   

Don't forget classes that share sets like cloths and 99% of the times there is x2 cloths per group.

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You can't forget that in 5.x, you wouldnt really equip the drops, you would sell in the broker or npc or extract for craft. Also, gear would break in 5.x.

The best way is how it was in 4.x

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11 minutes ago, Kubei-DN said:

Or just make it a box drop for each member and hope for the item you want.

mmm

1 box with random drop for everyone? not so bad. Still we will have a lot of RNG there. we need 17 items for the complete gear. so probably we will need a lot of boxes to get them all. 

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We get literally 1 new dungeon every 9 months.  If anything gear is being given out too fast.  The whole point is to be geared at the end of the 9 month (or however long) period. Not to be geared in 2 weeks get bored with the game and leave.  There are many people who actually want to play THIS game.  

LOL The OP is over here talking about doing 50 runs.   I have done 50 runs in a week and seen less loot than what you linked.... and definitely no loot for my class.  and I think this is exactly how loot should be done.  There is nothing worse than spending countless hours and money on a game only to have some scrub play for 2 weeks and be equally geared as me.  Well guess what?  YOU CAN'T DO THAT ANYMORE!!!!

You put in WORK and money in the game and you will get every piece of gear your little heart desires in due time.  You do the minimum and never spend any money on a game you play 100s of hours and you won't achieve much.  Yep sounds about right to me.  If anything they need to make progression harder!

 

But don't worry all.  The entitled give out gear for free patch is just around the corner.  Come 6.5 you will just do a daily quest kill some mobs or something easy and get all kinds of ultimates thrown at you.  As a matter of fact why am I putting time and money in this game.. I'll just wait for the game to get easy!  But yeah the game is always the same.  First the hard progression patch.  Then the easy lots of gear patch.  If you can't stand all the fail and hard to come by loot.  Then just come back next patch when its easier.  

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Liiny-DN   
1 hour ago, Phantom-EK said:

 I have done 50 runs in a week and seen less loot than what you linked.... and definitely no loot for my class.  and I think this is exactly how loot should be done. 

Yes, everyone loves to do 50 runs to be rewarded with nothing but minium. Sounds about right.

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59 minutes ago, Phantom-EK said:

We get literally 1 new dungeon every 9 months.  If anything gear is being given out too fast.  The whole point is to be geared at the end of the 9 month (or however long) period. Not to be geared in 2 weeks get bored with the game and leave.  There are many people who actually want to play THIS game.  

LOL The OP is over here talking about doing 50 runs.   I have done 50 runs in a week and seen less loot than what you linked.... and definitely no loot for my class.  and I think this is exactly how loot should be done.  There is nothing worse than spending countless hours and money on a game only to have some scrub play for 2 weeks and be equally geared as me.  Well guess what?  YOU CAN'T DO THAT ANYMORE!!!!

You put in WORK and money in the game and you will get every piece of gear your little heart desires in due time.  You do the minimum and never spend any money on a game you play 100s of hours and you won't achieve much.  Yep sounds about right to me.  If anything they need to make progression harder!

 

? wtf? you're saying its okay to be dissapointed EVERY SINGLE RUN? if you actually read my post i said you can get ONE piece of gear per 2 weeks. I can't think of ANYONE who thinks like you, they absolutely need to NOT make progression harder, because if it keeps going like this, the pve population will be long gone before 6.5.

1 hour ago, Phantom-EK said:

 

But don't worry all.  The entitled give out gear for free patch is just around the corner.  Come 6.5 you will just do a daily quest kill some mobs or something easy and get all kinds of ultimates thrown at you.  As a matter of fact why am I putting time and money in this game.. I'll just wait for the game to get easy!  But yeah the game is always the same.  First the hard progression patch.  Then the easy lots of gear patch.  If you can't stand all the fail and hard to come by loot.  Then just come back next patch when its easier.  

I play in Korea and done those quests, it is not a easy quest mob, you have to kill over 100 mobs COUNTLESS times to get just 1 piece of LEGENDARY gear, please get your facts right

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Something needs to be done about this game, they expect you to waste your entire life getting one simple thing, or else pay. .

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4 hours ago, Raiuken-KT said:

Something needs to be done about this game, they expect you to waste your entire life getting one simple thing, or else pay. .

Really... its taking your entire life to get 1 simple thing?

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4 hours ago, Liiny-DN said:

Yes, everyone loves to do 50 runs to be rewarded with nothing but minium. Sounds about right.

Well of course no one loves it.  It is like people just want to log into video games and be constantly rewarded?  I don't get it.  There are plenty of those types of games out there though... they bore you stiff after 2 weeks of being given every piece of loot. 

 

4 hours ago, Brutallus-DN said:

? wtf? you're saying its okay to be dissapointed EVERY SINGLE RUN? if you actually read my post i said you can get ONE piece of gear per 2 weeks. I can't think of ANYONE who thinks like you, they absolutely need to NOT make progression harder, because if it keeps going like this, the pve population will be long gone before 6.5.

I play in Korea and done those quests, it is not a easy quest mob, you have to kill over 100 mobs COUNTLESS times to get just 1 piece of LEGENDARY gear, please get your facts right

The only thing that kills the PVE population is giving out gear so easily.  Most gamers play as hard as they can until they aquire the "best" gear and leave so if gear is so easily acquired those gamers will leave all the more sooner.

Get my facts right?   Lets focus on the fact that you don't buy prestige or extra dungeon runs and expect to be given all the free loot with 4 runs a week?  haaaa  Meanwhile everyone who has been buying prestige and a few extra runs every now and again has had no problems getting loot... hmmmm weird!

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36 minutes ago, Phantom-EK said:

Well of course no one loves it.  It is like people just want to log into video games and be constantly rewarded?  I don't get it.  There are plenty of those types of games out there though... they bore you stiff after 2 weeks of being given every piece of loot. 

I keep telling you to read my post, but I guess you don't want to for some reason. I said only ONE (do you know that number?) out of EIGHT pieces of gear per 2 weeks, some need MORE than 2 weeks. Please, just read my post, then comment.

37 minutes ago, Phantom-EK said:

 

The only thing that kills the PVE population is giving out gear so easily.  Most gamers play as hard as they can until they aquire the "best" gear and leave so if gear is so easily acquired those gamers will leave all the more sooner.

Get my facts right?   Lets focus on the fact that you don't buy prestige or extra dungeon runs and expect to be given all the free loot with 4 runs a week?  haaaa  Meanwhile everyone who has been buying prestige and a few extra runs every now and again has had no problems getting loot... hmmmm weird!

Dude, you don't understand, I keep saying that it's EXTREMELY discouraging for a person to keep wasting 2 hours (30 min per run) of their free time per week for what? Nothing, of course. All of the people in our static except 2 people (one doesn't have any!) have only 1 piece of ultimate gear, and we've done the instance countless of times. Spending 100$ a month on ONLY runs that'll make me want to kill myself cause I wasted 100$ on nothing won't make it any better, in fact, it will make me want to quit the game since I became a whale and have gotten nothing back. How can you do 50 runs over a week (I really hope you're overexaggerating, it's literally 25+ hours of runs) and have less than a 20% chance of getting something, that who knows? will it be duplicate? will it be not for your class? will it be not for your group at ALL?

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14 hours ago, Phantom-EK said:

The only thing that kills the PVE population is giving out gear so easily.

This statement is just... wrong. The PvE population dies even faster if its players aren't being rewarded enough. It comes down to a careful balance between progression and longevity. Allow players to progress too fast, and they will be left with nothing to do until the next patch comes out, but focus too much on longevity by making progression excruciatingly difficult, and players will leave discouraged. The latter is Aion's current situation, only much worse. PvE progression is currently locked behind a RNG-exclusive looting system. Not only that, the RNG is absolutely atrocious. Assuming a 70% chance for ultimates to drop from PF/IDD (it's probably lower than that), there is only a 1.2% chance per run to get a specific piece of armor you need, assuming you are the only one rolling for it in your group. For the rest of your gear, it's: 1.9% for wings/plume/bracelet, 1.4% for ring/necklace/belt/earring, 0.4%-0.9% for weapon (depending on class). Again, this is assuming no one else in your group is rolling. Nobody should be forced to play the game with such abysmal progression rates.

The only praise I can give Aion's current PvE loot system is that it's not as horrible as its enchanting system. But honestly, if the only positive thing I can say about something is that it's not the worst thing ever, it's probably time to change. 

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Noona-DN   
On 2/15/2019 at 1:59 PM, Brutallus-DN said:

THE ISSUE

tl:dr at bottom

Since the update, PvE has been very unrewarding and very luck dependent. The instances themselves are fine (boss mechanics, difficulty etc) but the loot is a major problem. Primeth’s Forge (PF, 6 people) and Infernal Drakenspire Depths (IDD, 12 people), the only instances that can drop PvE ultimate gear, have a CHANCE to drop said gear (I’m not sure of the exact %, but it is definitely too low). I don’t understand NC’s logic behind this, as all instances in the past always dropped something.

 

Bless your post-4.0 heart. Patches 1.5 and 2.0 were like this (don't remember if 3.0 was as well) with Fire Temple & Beshmundir Temple, only difference was you didn't have to fight 12 people for it. 

Your best bet is to find a group/alliance of equally frustrated players and keep running with them. This way, there isn't always someone new rolling on gear. 

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