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LadySparks-KT

Ia AION becoming a only PvP game?

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I only play as a PvE player and reading about the update I see only one place for level 80 to play relatively secure which are Gelkamaros and Inggison with some rifts for both sides, all the rest of the maps are open-world PvP.

Well, I find AION so much changed from the beginning that is very sad, I remember when in Eltnen I was looking for rifts so I could try to hide and it was the same on every map, only the abyss was true PvP, but now is exactly the contrary.

I wonder why so many people like so much PvP. :)

Okay I'm done with my rant, thanks and bye bye.

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Kubei-DN   

There is PvE, but you'll have to wait an entire week once you clear all your instances. The game has always been about end game PvP, but it wouldn't be such an issue if there was actually some sort of balancing.

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Aly-DN   

Aion has always been heavy on the PvP at end game. It has gotten away from leveling PvP, but that seems to have given players the false notion that PvP is completely optional and voluntary. At end game, it is neither. PvP will be forced on you from time to time once you hit max level. You can't 100% opt-out.

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PVE only maps should exist in the sense of Pernon, just fun and things that do not alter the game itself, at least not too much. I wouldn't have an issue with people who want to be in safe zones to be able to. If anyone ever quit the game because of forced pvp, then that is a bad thing for the game itself.

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Posted (edited)

  I don't know if it's an Aion thing, the world idelogies seeping into the MMOs, or NA people way of thinking, but i never saw so many complaints about PvP in forums from other games in the past, as there are in Aion. Like for example players saying '' i didn't gave my consent to be PvPed '' 

  I have to admit that my that my stay in NA forums these last years, reading all the complaints, laments and tantrums about ''Forced PvP'' rubbed on me, and i'm a softie now, forgiving asmo lives here, waiting for asmo to finish their quests over there, not completing my own quests because: look at him with his poor ancient/green transform for the wrong class... Kyaa!! he is so CUTE, i can't kill him.
  When in the past in my previous MMOs i was Rutheless! at those times i could kill a baby girl in wheelchairs gathering Inina in Verteron, without think twice. But now... here i am a comprehensive and tolerant PvPer. (not with Vandals anymore) LMAO

6 hours ago, Aly-DN said:

Aion has always been heavy on the PvP at end game. It has gotten away from leveling PvP, but that seems to have given players the false notion that PvP is completely optional and voluntary. 

Now that you mention this i can agree that this is one of the reasons why people is confused or complains at end game, the carebear in low lvl maps 100% safe like Poeta, Sanctum, Verteron, Theobomos, Rift closed times in other maps, and back in the day the PvE Haven the Fast Track Server. I guess all this gives the wrong picture to some players.

Yes i named super low lv maps Poeta and Sanctum, because in the games i played before, like Metin2 and Rosh/Karos, there was PvP action, from enemy faction or from PK players right from the first lowest level map.

Edited by DevilNest-KT

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1 hour ago, Arhangelos-KT said:

PVE only maps should exist in the sense of Pernon, just fun and things that do not alter the game itself, at least not too much. I wouldn't have an issue with people who want to be in safe zones to be able to. If anyone ever quit the game because of forced pvp, then that is a bad thing for the game itself.

Incoming rage:

 

A TONNNNNNNNNN of people quit between Launch - 2.0, not only because of the Korean grindfest but because you couldn't go anywhere to level up without being 100-0'd by permarifters. By 1.9, I was safer leveling in the Abyss than in Morheim/Beluslan (I did 38-45 in the Abyss off the upper fortress repeatables and I almost maxed out on them, lol). They had to add rift buffs in 2.0 because it was so bad.

And then I have a rant on other patches and their BS (5.X was 1.X on steroids), but I think the biggest ones were launch -> 2.0 because grindfest and unplayability and then 5.X with its triple whammy of Korean grindfest, breakable gear, and hackers.

 

2 minutes ago, DevilNest-KT said:

  I don't know if it's an Aion thing, the world idelogies seeping into the MMOs, or NA people way of thinking, but i never saw so many complaints about PvP in forums from other games in the past, as there are in Aion. Like for example players saying '' i didn't gave my consent to be PvPed '' 

  I have to admit that my that my stay in NA forums these last years, reading all the complaints, laments and tantrums about ''Forced PvP'' rubbed on me, and i'm a softie now, forgiving asmo lives here, waiting for asmo to finish their quests over there, not completing my own quests because: look at him with his poor ancient/green transform for the wrong class... Kyaa!! he is so CUTE, i can't kill him. When in the past in my previous MMOs i was Rutheless! at those times i could kill a baby girl in wheelchairs gathering Inina in Verteron, without think twice. But now... here i am a comprehensive and tolerant PvPer. (not with Vandals anymore) LMAO

Now that you mention this i can agree that this is one of the reasons why people is confused or complains at end game, the carebear in low lvl maps 100% safe like Poeta, Sanctum, Verteron, Theobomos, Rift closed times in other maps, and back in the day the PvE Haven the Fast Track Server. I guess all this gives the wrong picture to some players.

Yes i named super low lv maps Poeta and Sanctum, because in the games i played before, like Metin2 and Rosh/Karos, there was PvP action, from enemy faction or from PK players right from the first lowest level map.

I was all on board with PvPvE until I saw how it was implemented/the gear disparity/etc, and now I'm 150% trackstar carebear for most areas of the game. :|

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49 minutes ago, DevilNest-KT said:

and i'm a softie now, forgiving asmo lives here, waiting for asmo to finish their quests over there, not completing my own quests because: look at him with his poor ancient/green transform for the wrong class... Kyaa!! he is so CUTE, i can't kill him.
  When in the past in my previous MMOs i was Rutheless! at those times i could kill a baby girl in wheelchairs gathering Inina in Verteron, without think twice. But now... here i am a comprehensive and tolerant PvPer

I am the same, and I've forced @Hellish-DN to become that way (not as much as me, but more than he used to be) lmao. If he attacks someone and it takes like 50% off their HP, I'm like OH MY GOD STOP STOP STOP and then we'll leave them alone as long as they back off of us hahaha. Or a lot of times I will just stand awkwardly off to the side while he kills someone because I don't want the person to think we are trying to zerg them if we're trying to finish the daily 10-kill quest. Sigh. And yeah, a green xform is an insta-pass from us because that's just pitiful in this day and age lol. It's clearly someone who just logs in once in a blue moon and is very, very casual.

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Calm-EK   
15 hours ago, LadySparks-KT said:

I only play as a PvE player and reading about the update I see only one place for level 80 to play relatively secure which are Gelkamaros and Inggison with some rifts for both sides, all the rest of the maps are open-world PvP.

Well, I find AION so much changed from the beginning that is very sad, I remember when in Eltnen I was looking for rifts so I could try to hide and it was the same on every map, only the abyss was true PvP, but now is exactly the contrary.

I wonder why so many people like so much PvP. :)

Okay I'm done with my rant, thanks and bye bye.

PvE for me has always been too gear heavy and braindead. PvP puts your reaction time (and ping) and skill to work. You can beat someone with more gear if you are faster/more skillful.

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42 minutes ago, Calm-EK said:

PvE for me has always been too gear heavy and braindead. PvP puts your reaction time (and ping) and skill to work. You can beat someone with more gear if you are faster/more skillful.

Depends on the class. :/

You'll have a very bad time as an undergeared sorc. Or even a geared sorc.

Glad, though? Yeah.

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Calm-EK   
1 minute ago, Cheesecake-DN said:

Depends on the class. :/

You'll have a very bad time as an undergeared sorc. Or even a geared sorc.

Glad, though? Yeah.

Yeah, after 4.5 sorcs got the short end of the stick for sure. But pre 4.5 I was killing lvl 60s as a lvl 30 sorc lol. I would die in 1 hit if I failed once tho.

But, to your point, now things have changed a hell of a lot. Things do feel a lot more black or white...

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Cyfur-EK   

Once upon a time we had maps like Theobomos and Verteron which were PvE only, later on maps like Sarpan were introduced that had times where they were world PvP and times when they were neutral, which I thought was a great idea. Then the original Katalam had pink neutral zones with some quests which was not quite as good. Now we have virtually no world PvE, you have to rely on instances, with limited group sizes largely defeating the purpose of an MMORPG.

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Posted (edited)

I would gladly see a full safe zone fast track server then, of course that was so people could level up which now is unnecessary. But here is what, if we have a full safe-zone pve map, it will become a bot heaven. So we go back to zero talking about forced pvp.

My resolution would have been all pve instance entrances could and should have been in the main city where pvp is not allowed (like Stellusia, not Lakrum that enemies can attack and guards are useless). This way you could do all your pve instances without having to step a foot outside. And then of course doing weekleis in camps etc is again forced pvp, what can you do.

They could make like 2 hours every day, a global pve zone everywhere, botters couldn't really take advantage of everything, non pvp players could do everything they need those 2 hours. It could have been a dead-hour zone so nobody has an issue.

P.S. I am happy Danuar Mysticarium is returning, I mastered the sh!t out of it and I made my ceraniumset with that instance :D

Edited by Arhangelos-KT

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Aly-DN   

If you made PvP voluntary at end-game, you take away the premise of Aion. That's the bottom line.

I played through the prema-rifters and the twinks and all the measures Korean put in place to try and stop the whole-sale exit of players who left Aion because they 100% couldn't level because twinks were one-shotting them. I spent at least an hour each morning on my level 50 gladi in Eltnen killing kisks and camping rifts as I gathered. The whole twink mind-set is crap and characters that did it needs to be tossed into a virtual fire and roasted into ash which then would be flushed down the big ol' potty that is Aion today. 

BUT.. and it's a big butt.. Aion is designed around PvP. Everything at end-game is designed around getting players out into the open world so that they can act like quest mobs for PvP weeklies and dailies. The majority of players get their kills and leave. The -real- PvPers will respond when someone gives a shout that they are enemies killing them over and over. There are actually very few tardlets who only prey on the weak and will continue to kill them past their quest needs.

If the devs were to make a flag system or some such that would make PvP totally voluntary, I believe more players would quit and not just the PvP players. Aion's PvE just isn't interesting enough to keep people's attention. So there has to be something else that keeps them focused and gets their heart racing. Since the instance itself isn't interesting, they make getting to the instance interesting. Since doing the same freaking repeat quest for the millionth time isn't interesting, the threat of PvP while doing the quest keeps it interesting.

There just has to be a way to educate new players while they level that when they get to end-game, they will have to deal with PvP so that it isn't this horrible crushing surprise.

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Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, Aly-DN said:

If the devs were to make a flag system or some such that would make PvP totally voluntary, I believe more players would quit and not just the PvP players. Aion's PvE just isn't interesting enough to keep people's attention.

If we took Aion as it is and implement pve-only areas then yes, it would flop badly. PVE aspects at the moment flop because they are just 5~6 instances that you have to spam 200 times each in hopes of getting that item to drop for your class.

If we had to talk about different routes for pve-only features then it would have to be taken into consideration in the game development itself. Games that have pve only servers and pvp servers, already take that into consideration content wise.

Aion simply got rid of the fun parts of aion in the 6.0 destruction. If they didn't delete things and even better keep adding side things for fun, Aion could have ended up an "environment" that has a ton of things to do for fun (housing, professions, skin farming or crafting, or designing)

They can always take a right path at any given point, but all asian companies will never please the west gamers as they do not understand us, and asian players act like total NPCs, they enjoy aimlessly grinding and will accept whatever is given to them, as their feedback i taken into consideration for future patches.

I have already said it in another post, farmville has millions of users around the world, it is in flash, pseudo-3D and has no action, it is just a farming cute game where you design your home and fields and you place cows! If Aion wanted to be fun-friendly, it could have ended up being the new Sims-online for those that do not want to have anything to do with pvp, ranks and sieges.

~In a parallel universe of course

Edited by Arhangelos-KT

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I've given up the PvP game, sometime around 5.0 I think? I got sick of grinding for weeks or months with my IRL schedule being what it was in order to get gear only for it to become obsolete and borderline useless with the next big update. Aion is definitely now more about end game PvP than ever before but I disagree with those saying it was ALWAYS about that. Aion used to definitely be more about a constant PvPvE experience from start to finish. You'd encounter players your level and with relatively the same experience and gear back in the day from start to finish. This helped you develop skills and give you a taste for the combat. You learned how and who to engage or how to avoid it if you desperately wanted to. I still remember being a baby gladiator in Eltnen who was slotting a crap load of parry stones for survivability. The only things I feared were rangers and clerics. Twinks ruined this system and the changes (some good some bad) kept rolling in from there until we ended up where we are today. In Aion today, you don't stand a snowballs chance in hell if you aren't climbing up the enchantment ladder and capping your stats. You'll be ripped apart without the best gear and transforms.

Like Arhangelos said, Aion also used to have so much more to do, the majority of which was butchered in 6.0. Aion IS all about end game PvP now and it will never be about anything else again. We get what they get in the East, and this is apparently what a lot of them wanted.

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Posted (edited)
On 5/27/2020 at 10:36 PM, Arhangelos-KT said:

They can always take a right path at any given point, but all asian companies will never please the west gamers as they do not understand us, and asian players act like total NPCs, they enjoy aimlessly grinding and will accept whatever is given to them, as their feedback i taken into consideration for future patches.

You act as if the biggest games in Asian countries are all grindy games.The biggest games in Korea are instant games just like every where else in the world. League/pugb/fortnite and probably valorant now are all top games in almost every country around the world. Given this information i would say that very few grindy MMORPG's would be at the top of the list for games play in Asian countries. You hear about them alot because you mostly hear about people who spend 10s of 1000s on them.

The problem with MMORPG's is the gamers themselves. IMO when i look back and all the research i done for Aion when i was gonna release a video that was 3+ hours long that was just impossible to condense. I would say the Aion of today resembles player feedback more than players want to admit.

  • The QQ about sorcs being able to insta gib people with quick casting and crazy damage  - Now nerfed 
  • They crying melee is to weak vs ranged despite them being a very competitive classes since the RS when silence became available. 
  • The complaint that players had to rely on other classes for max attack speed while others could get it with normal stigma's.
  • The QQ where clerics/chanters had over whelming advantages because they could full heal them selves(now so can nearly every class if their is mobs in open world).
  • The complaints that you had to PvE to get the best PvP gear.

The list could go on and on but i am just giving examples on how the players have influenced the game be it the Korean players only or the western players it is more westernized than you think.

Edited by HealingSquid-KT

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, HealingSquid-KT said:

You act as if the biggest games in Asian countries are all grindy games.

I obviously referred to mmorpgs. Lineage II (I was an avid player) was the biggest grindfest ever created. Aion had more things to do but they deleted them. They could be adding features instead of removing.

The rest of your post is about class imbalance and how some hybrid classes got used to being tank+dps+healers and when they got it removed they were mad.

Edited by Arhangelos-KT

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Arhangelos-KT said:

I obviously referred to mmorpgs. Lineage II (I was an avid player) was the biggest grindfest ever created. Aion had more things to do but they deleted them. They could be adding features instead of removing.

The rest of your post is about class imbalance and how some hybrid classes got used to being tank+dps+healers and when they got it removed they were mad.

The thing with MMORPG's is no one ever releases numbers of co-current players by country. If i were a betting man i would bet that WoW currently has more co-current player base than any Asian released MMORPG in all Asian countries but we will never know for sure because developers are not forced in to letting this information out to the public and is often why many games steer clear of platforms such as steam and so on.

What i am getting at is developers in Asia are just getting a slice of the pie. Some get a bigger slice due to timing/graphics or others get it due to power = king and players pay for power. This does not mean they are the most played games in their country tho.

Edited by HealingSquid-KT

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