Jump to content
Forums

Skill changes for the upcoming update - 7.5 part 2 vs. 7.5 part 1


Recommended Posts

14 hours ago, Malachyte-KT said:

I'm going to be honest, I was on the "sorcs are in need of help train" until I started seeing people like Pro, Fealty's sorc, Ereshkigal, Vesu (when his ass played), and a couple others on their sorcs in PVP and literally 2-4 shot peeps who are also maxed geared.  This includes plate classes with approaching and beyond 100k HP.  In Pro's case he routinely hits people for 33-43K+ dmg and openly communicates via discord when who or when he is sleeping a target. There are plenty of KR sorc AoD and open-world pvp video for 7.5 and 7.7 which are showing the class routinely annihilating people. Qzxw and Ckdrmsdl are a couple sorcs off the top of my head. They have no problems using sleep and even utilize it not solely for the CC component but to wait out certain buffs on classes to expire before a quick 2-4 skill cast rotation that quickly dispatches the poor target that sat there slept for like 10s+ just waiting to die.

These same sorcs are routinely at the top of the parse for PvE instances, WB, and Siege to boot. BlackRaven is a prime example of a great PvE sorc and he plays from a place where his ping isn't the greatest.


I don't know how it is on the asmo side as I haven't ran into any sorcs or heard of any that cause any kind of trepidation as those busters i mentioned up above.  Is it possible you guys may just need to rethink your gear load out priority, enchant up stigmas/gemstones/runestones/, and adjust skill rotations? Maybe what worked in the past patches, isn't what's best now in this patch?

I'm not trying to talk down to you guys at all as I too believed you guys needed some love but man, I've recently been thinking otherwise.

1 - I doubt most players have complained about sorcs in PVE  - the issue has been PVP

2 - communication over voice is hardly new order to most efficiently work with slept targets however this is a big disadvantage for many groups and they would just rather take an sm

3 anyone who seriously mains a sorc,  and Is at least semi - serious about PVP, has been continuously looking at their gear , stigmas, rotations, etc Otherwise they rerolled or quit or stuck with PVE. 
 

Finally to those who post the “in KR x class is fine” please Stop

1- we are not playing under the same gear conditions

2 we aren’t playing under the same ping

3 an arena video and a few top players may be inspiring but that that doesn’t represent the average player

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 104
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

I think its clear to say that KR is better skilled then NA. And I dont want to have to survive off pots that i cant even buy an infinite amount of for cheap. I didnt buff up, but still looking at that

DPS goes up yes, Damage does go down.  Overall damage is lessened.   Earth Damage 2,297 -> 2,067 Initial Earth Damage over Time 34,455 -> 31,005 It will tick twice as often, for 10%

The problem is not the damage a sorc can do, @Arhangelos-KT, me and others who have sorcs have said it before the problem is the defence skills that are completly outdated, and now not only that, but

30 minutes ago, Rapier-DN said:

3 an arena video and a few top players may be inspiring but that that doesn’t represent the average player

...exactly and in arena you post those you ripped, not those that literally destroyed you and you had to rage quit.

As I said, I killed a Templar in Transform solo, but that wouldn't count as "sorc is op" the guy was either in his pve gear and forgot to flip or simply didn't know well his class.

Edited by Arhangelos-KT
Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Malachyte-KT said:

I'm going to be honest, I was on the "sorcs are in need of help train" until I started seeing people like Pro, Fealty's sorc, Ereshkigal, Vesu (when his ass played), and a couple others on their sorcs in PVP and literally 2-4 shot peeps who are also maxed geared.  This includes plate classes with approaching and beyond 100k HP.  In Pro's case he routinely hits people for 33-43K+ dmg and openly communicates via discord when who or when he is sleeping a target. There are plenty of KR sorc AoD and open-world pvp video for 7.5 and 7.7 which are showing the class routinely annihilating people. Qzxw and Ckdrmsdl are a couple sorcs off the top of my head. They have no problems using sleep and even utilize it not solely for the CC component but to wait out certain buffs on classes to expire before a quick 2-4 skill cast rotation that quickly dispatches the poor target that sat there slept for like 10s+ just waiting to die.

These same sorcs are routinely at the top of the parse for PvE instances, WB, and Siege to boot. BlackRaven is a prime example of a great PvE sorc and he plays from a place where his ping isn't the greatest.


I don't know how it is on the asmo side as I haven't ran into any sorcs or heard of any that cause any kind of trepidation as those busters i mentioned up above.  Is it possible you guys may just need to rethink your gear load out priority, enchant up stigmas/gemstones/runestones/, and adjust skill rotations? Maybe what worked in the past patches, isn't what's best now in this patch?

I'm not trying to talk down to you guys at all as I too believed you guys needed some love but man, I've recently been thinking otherwise.

nerf Pro/sorc he can kill anyone with 2-3 skills even a squishy cleric like me :(

Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, Zombiex-DN said:

nerf Pro/sorc he can kill anyone with 2-3 skills even a squishy cleric like me :(

Pro cleric lessons vs sorc

1-  stop watching Netflix

2- remember to wear gear, preferably PVP gear

Enjoy your win vs all except  the top 1% best players and best geared sorcs.

 

Edited by Rapier-DN
Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Rapier-DN said:

1 - I doubt most players have complained about sorcs in PVE  - the issue has been PVP

2 - communication over voice is hardly new order to most efficiently work with slept targets however this is a big disadvantage for many groups and they would just rather take an sm

3 anyone who seriously mains a sorc,  and Is at least semi - serious about PVP, has been continuously looking at their gear , stigmas, rotations, etc Otherwise they rerolled or quit or stuck with PVE. 
 

Finally to those who post the “in KR x class is fine” please Stop

1- we are not playing under the same gear conditions

2 we aren’t playing under the same ping

3 an arena video and a few top players may be inspiring but that that doesn’t represent the average player

1. You'd be surprised, some of those same sorcs bemoaning their PVP issues say that they not even top in PVE because other classes do it better, I'm pointing out that I know some sorcs where that isn't much of an issue. And one of them, BlackRaven, is COMPLETELY FTP. What sorcs did in the past patches, prob not working now or for a while an need adjustment or prioritize other stats, gear build out, or skills in their rotation.

2. Once again, the problem is either you or the people you run with if you aren't a cohesive team/group that play off each other's skills when openly communicating it. Sleep is still extremely useful in grp PVP ESPECIALLY with an SM there. I group with those guys and I hear, I'm sleeping "3" Mala can you fear "5", or I'm fearing 4, sleep "3" or I'm grp sleeping, no AEs.  And we almost always have glads in the grp and they comply just fine.  If you don't realize the benefits of actually utilizing sleep in a grp fight properly, then you need to recognize there are other ways than what you currently know, utilize, or theorize.

3. With each patch/update that brings tweaks of gear stats and skills rotations changes. Now that +15 stigmas are obtainable, other builds are possibly more viable. Now that +15 daevians are becoming common, different rotations may be more effective. Collections and Cubics also play a major role and if you didn't invest in those when it was opportune you are in a big uphill battle. Point is, a few sorcs are able to churn out the dmg while most others are seriously struggling- that points to the player's ability and ability to adjust to the changes than the class more than anything.

 

On your final thoughts:

1- If by gear conditions you mean KR gear than no, but we are all playing under NA gear conditions. Outside of Transformations favoring atk speed classes in the past and now has been remedied for cast speed players, our gear to other NA players are comparable. 

2- I have one of the fastest pings of most people in NA Aion to begin with (routinely 9-16ms on average and jumps up to 22ms in seige- I'm on Fiber Internet from Dallas, Texas to the NAServers in Austin, Texas about 3hrs away. I'm not using any pinging service either.  Let me tell you what it's like playing against people with 50ms+ pings and higher while having a super low ping- it can really suck sometimes. Fear makes them jump around the map (literally) and rubber band  where I seriously restrain myself most times from using it to the point that my own people I run with have a running joke that I am the SM that doesn't fear (not that i need it most times)... It's not always the case but I honestly try not to cast it unless there is a movement speed debuff on them first because then it really gets out of hand if they have max run speed.  The issue is that I get faster packet updates from the NA Servers that tell my client where you are on the map, however, your client takes precedence on your location when your client updates the NA Server on where you are on the map. So for 3-4 secs I could be on you after a fear, then literally at second 5 you are 24m away rubber banded in the opposite direction and out of range.  Most times, my ping show you at a certain range (happens alot at 24m-30m for me) and yet your client says i'm closer to you and I get hit with melee attacks that even with an extendable that shouldn't be possible. Templar normal pulls is an example. It's annoying. Now if EVERYONE had identical ping it wouldn't be an issue. In KR they all have sub 10ms ping but South Korea is known in the world for having among the highest average broadband speeds and it's small enough that you don't have to take so many hops to get to the NCSoft server. They are like top 7 in internet speeds while US is like 14, now take in account the players on NAServers that aren't even in the US and what their country's average broadband speed is and it has to come to the server farms near central Texas which one of the southern most states and one of the largest to boot.

3- To inspire means to give others new ideas and enthusiasm- since it's proven that other players can do great at being sorcs, perhaps some "inspiration" is all they need to realize that there are other ways to play the class from what they knew in previous patches.. Most of those guys I named are similarly geared and relatable with exception to one. But their gear is also similar to the average high end player's +15 DT armor and weapon and Katalam/Demaha/PFHM/AoA accessories of their class and others. If you don't have at least +15 DT armor and weapon with Demaha/Katalam accessories along with +15 stigmas/Daevian skills and some good runestones and gemstones then from the jump you have work to put in to fight the top geared on better terms, but vs the average player it's more than enough. 

Edited by Malachyte-KT
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Rapier-DN said:

Pro cleric lessons vs sorc

1-  stop watching Netflix

2- remember to wear gear, preferably PVP gear

Enjoy your win vs all except  the top 1% best players and best geared sorcs.

 

unknown.png

i guess 40k crit is too low for a nerfed class

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Zombiex-DN said:

unknown.png

i guess 40k crit is too low for a nerfed class

I guess anyone can post a log without any context and expect it prove something.

It proves absolutely..nothing.  We know nothing about the circumstances- gear disparity for one thing. The only thing the log can tell you for sure is that the sorc had some advanced DPS skills such as the +15 version of GS.

If I look at 25 k ..well guess what..anyone  (any class) can hit for 25 k or more..and typically without cast time, while mobile, and attack speed capped. Oh yes-  often with better shields and  pretty much without exception with better HP recovery skills. Hell, even a temp can 2-shot someone.

Not to mention- guess who has the lowest HP pool in the game when they do get hit like that? that's right- sorcs. 

In other words- these logs can't be used like the  PVE DPS logs that you are more likely used to

 

45 minutes ago, Malachyte-KT said:

or the 23-25k non-crits. 

Look at the log lmao. Look at the times. Was it an arena? or was it faked?

Who knows.

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Malachyte-KT said:

1. You'd be surprised, some of those same sorcs bemoaning their PVP issues say that they not even top in PVE because other classes do it better, I'm pointing out that I know some sorcs where that isn't much of an issue. And one of them, BlackRaven, is COMPLETELY FTP. What sorcs did in the past patches, prob not working now or for a while an need adjustment or prioritize other stats, gear build out, or skills in their rotation. Again,  I don't know any sorc main who has played for awhile who has expressed serious PVE issues. It is condescending to think that no sorc mains have thought about adjustments to skills or rotations, runes, odians, etc.

2. Once again, the problem is either you or the people you run with if you aren't a cohesive team/group that play off each other's skills when openly communicating it. Sleep is still extremely useful in grp PVP ESPECIALLY with an SM there. I group with those guys and I hear, I'm sleeping "3" Mala can you fear "5", or I'm fearing 4, sleep "3" or I'm grp sleeping, no AEs.  And we almost always have glads in the grp and they comply just fine.  If you don't realize the benefits of actually utilizing sleep in a grp fight properly, then you need to recognize there are other ways than what you currently know, utilize, or theorize.  You are completely misinterpreting what I said.  Again, I said that voice coms  as a part of startegey in CC are not new. Also, groups WITHOUT voice coms prefer an SM. I never said that sleep in group was not useful HOWEVER in 7.7. I do believe it will be less useful.

3. With each patch/update that brings tweaks of gear stats and skills rotations changes. Now that +15 stigmas are obtainable, other builds are possibly more viable. Now that +15 daevians are becoming common, different rotations may be more effective. Collections and Cubics also play a major role and if you didn't invest in those when it was opportune you are in a big uphill battle. Point is, a few sorcs are able to churn out the dmg while most others are seriously struggling- that points to the player's ability and ability to adjust to the changes than the class more than anything. You cannot invent skills if they do not exist. Again- pure damage is not the answer. That's an overly simplistic view. Especially funny coming from an SM.

Wall of text crits. By the way- you are talking to someone who is +15 DT geared and has played since beta. You don't need to believe me. Don't care. But the fact is that other classes are far more forgiving. At some point, most sorcs that have an interest in PVP walk away since  other classes are just so much easier.

On your final thoughts:

1- If by gear conditions you mean KR gear than no, but we are all playing under NA gear conditions. Outside of Transformations favoring atk speed classes in the past and now has been remedied for cast speed players, our gear to other NA players are comparable.  

2- I have one of the fastest pings of most people in NA Aion to begin with (routinely 9-16ms on average and jumps up to 22ms in seige- I'm on Fiber Internet from Dallas, Texas to the NAServers in Austin, Texas about 3hrs away. I'm not using any pinging service either.  Let me tell you what it's like playing against people with 50ms+ pings and higher while having a super low ping- it can really suck sometimes. Fear makes them jump around the map (literally) and rubber band  where I seriously restrain myself most times from using it to the point that my own people I run with have a running joke that I am the SM that doesn't fear (not that i need it most times)... It's not always the case but I honestly try not to cast it unless there is a movement speed debuff on them first because then it really gets out of hand if they have max run speed.  The issue is that I get faster packet updates from the NA Servers that tell my client where you are on the map, however, your client takes precedence on your location when your client updates the NA Server on where you are on the map. So for 3-4 secs I could be on you after a fear, then literally at second 5 you are 24m away rubber banded in the opposite direction and out of range.  Most times, my ping show you at a certain range (happens alot at 24m-30m for me) and yet your client says i'm closer to you and I get hit with melee attacks that even with an extendable that shouldn't be possible. Templar normal pulls is an example. It's annoying. Now if EVERYONE had identical ping it wouldn't be an issue. In KR they all have sub 10ms ping but South Korea is known in the world for having among the highest average broadband speeds and it's small enough that you don't have to take so many hops to get to the NCSoft server. They are like top 7 in internet speeds while US is like 14, now take in account the players on NAServers that aren't even in the US and what their country's average broadband speed is and it has to come to the server farms near central Texas which one of the southern most states and one of the largest to boot.

3- To inspire means to give others new ideas and enthusiasm- since it's proven that other players can do great at being sorcs, perhaps some "inspiration" is all they need to realize that there are other ways to play the class from what they knew in previous patches.. Most of those guys I named are similarly geared and relatable with exception to one. But their gear is also similar to the average high end player's +15 DT armor and weapon and Katalam/Demaha/PFHM/AoA accessories of their class and others. If you don't have at least +15 DT armor and weapon with Demaha/Katalam accessories along with +15 stigmas/Daevian skills and some good runestones and gemstones then from the jump you have work to put in to fight the top geared on better terms, but vs the average player it's more than enough. 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

What does it matter if it’s arena, duel or open world? Zombie is geared. I am geared. Once we are slept, pro kills us in 4 shots and if I do outplay him and get him to mess up, he can just iron clad and win. Malachyte is being nice but I’ll just straight up say it, maybe some of y’all are just boo boo. Sorcs do insane damage and can sleep to set up those combos. Add runes that give them sleep penetration and more damage and they are a disgusting class when played right.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The problem is not the damage a sorc can do, @Arhangelos-KT, me and others who have sorcs have said it before the problem is the defence skills that are completly outdated, and now not only that, but also nerfed, Elemental ward is a stigma with magic defense and resist which was increased from 1,000 to 1,500 (1,300 to 1,800 advance stigma), thats nice but the duration of the buff went down from 30 seconds to 15 seconds in a stigma that has 2 minutes of cd without enchant. And thundering spear, our only skill we have to heal ourselfs in pvpve, 50% of the damage done was regenerated to our hp and now will be only 20% (60% to 30% advance daevanion skill) and the increase in the damage from 559 to 587 (671 to 705 advance) seems to be really low.

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Etrigan-KT said:

What does it matter if it’s arena, duel or open world? Zombie is geared. I am geared. Once we are slept, pro kills us in 4 shots and if I do outplay him and get him to mess up, he can just iron clad and win. Malachyte is being nice but I’ll just straight up say it, maybe some of y’all are just boo boo. Sorcs do insane damage and can sleep to set up those combos. Add runes that give them sleep penetration and more damage and they are a disgusting class when played right.

That was a bit harsh O.o I think the reason why they are being so defensive about sorc is because it seems to them that we are calling them god awful and sorc is a super easy class. Sorc is not a super easy class sure but I find the when dealing with people of equal gear and I mean sorcs, the difference between the good and "bad" ones are judgement. I consider a player good if when their cookie cutter, rotation doesn't do the job and they use their judgement to bring back the fight in their favor. Only true hard counters I will say a sorc should have a very hard time against are Sins, Rangers,Painter and Gunners probably but a sorc can still win. Also if you are going to say NA is different because of ping etc, I can also claim Cleric is bad and a weak class as well. Hell every class can claim that as a reason as to why they think their class is "under performing" or "bad". Glads up to this day still say Glad is a bad class.

Link to post
Share on other sites
50 minutes ago, Etrigan-KT said:

What does it matter if it’s arena, duel or open world? Zombie is geared. I am geared. Once we are slept, pro kills us in 4 shots and if I do outplay him and get him to mess up, he can just iron clad and win. Malachyte is being nice but I’ll just straight up say it, maybe some of y’all are just boo boo. Sorcs do insane damage and can sleep to set up those combos. Add runes that give them sleep penetration and more damage and they are a disgusting class when played right.

Ah yes- the old "played right" card.  and a 'disgusting" class? what does that even mean? More disgusting that being knocked down, pulled, feared or stunned?

Glads have received so many buffs over the patches that you can't even say that glad vs sorc isn't in YOUR favour now.  Years ago sorcs could easily kill glads, they were their anti-class, just as rangers could easily kill sorcs.  

Same with a sorc vs a cleric. I mean- it isn't as though clerics have shields, dots and dispels..oh..wait. You do realize that sorcs really have negligible magic defenses? So again, is the fight there really a cakewalk for the sorc?

and for the classes who claim that only the "bads" are complaining..again... the numbers tell the story. Fewer people are playing sorc as a main, there's generally a good reason.

and @Treos-DN no one "just iron clads" for a win. Not since 3.x.  If he messes up and ironclads against you I doubt very much that it is that easy to win.

 If I read your  "hard counters"  correctly,  you're basically saying that sorcs would be on an equal footing  with  SMs, temps, SW, glads, clerics and ATs? i.e. "not a very hard time with" . Really? I doubt that very much.

 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Rapier-DN said:

Ah yes- the old "played right" card.  and a 'disgusting" class? what does that even mean? More disgusting that being knocked down, pulled, feared or stunned?

Glads have received so many buffs over the patches that you can't even say that glad vs sorc isn't in YOUR favour now.  Years ago sorcs could easily kill glads, they were their anti-class, just as rangers could easily kill sorcs.  

Same with a sorc vs a cleric. I mean- it isn't as though clerics have shields, dots and dispels..oh..wait. You do realize that sorcs really have negligible magic defenses? So again, is the fight there really a cakewalk for the sorc?

and for the classes who claim that only the "bads" are complaining..again... the numbers tell the story. Fewer people are playing sorc as a main, there's generally a good reason.

and @Treos-DN no one "just iron clads" for a win. Not since 3.x.  If he messes up and ironclads against you I doubt very much that it is that easy to win.

 If I read your  "hard counters"  correctly,  you're basically saying that sorcs would be on an equal footing  with  SMs, temps, SW, glads, clerics and ATs? i.e. "not a very hard time with" . Really? I doubt that very much.

 

 

 

AT is a good class and no one plays it u know why? your whole point is if a class isn't popular its because its a weak class? are u serious
we can say the same for gunner .... gunner even less popular than sorc even no one plays it , ur argument has no sense bro

im not saying sorc is a broken class im just saying sorc is fine, theres no buff to make u win if u suck at ur class :) 

Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, Etrigan-KT said:

Everyone has had their life leech skills nerfed. I’ve seen geared sorcs with 22 MR with that buff and it only can go up with altar accessories. That sounds like fun for a cleric or gunner to fight... 

 

You have the cloth class with the worst shields and the worst HP recovery and the lowest HP pool getting a nerf on the HP recovery -sorcs

OK, other cloth classes may also be getting a nerf on their HP recovery.

Doesn't mean that sorcs should be happy.

Just now, Zombiex-DN said:

AT is a good class and no one plays it u know why? your whole point is if a class isn't popular its because its a weak class? are u serious
we can say the same for gunner .... gunner even less popular than sorc even no one plays it , ur argument has no sense bro

im not saying sorc is a broken class im just saying sorc is fine, theres no buff to make u win if u suck at ur class :) 

If I thought you could actually follow a discussion about population metrics, I would try.

However if you want to get into "u sucks" discussion, I'll let you go back to admiring your skin collection.

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Rapier-DN said:

 

You have the cloth class with the worst shields and the worst HP recovery and the lowest HP pool getting a nerf on the HP recovery -sorcs

OK, other cloth classes may also be getting a nerf on their HP recovery.

Doesn't mean that sorcs should be happy.

If I thought you could actually follow a discussion about population metrics, I would try.

However if you want to get into "u sucks" discussion, I'll let you go back to admiring your skin collection.

go check ur friend management window and see how many sorc, gunner and AT lvl 80 are online and say me the numbers lets see if sorc is really a no popular class
the class with less numbers should be the weakest class right? its ur argument

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Rapier-DN said:

 

You have the cloth class with the worst shields and the worst HP recovery and the lowest HP pool getting a nerf on the HP recovery -sorcs

OK, other cloth classes may also be getting a nerf on their HP recovery.

Doesn't mean that sorcs should be happy.

If I thought you could actually follow a discussion about population metrics, I would try.

However if you want to get into "u sucks" discussion, I'll let you go back to admiring your skin collection.

Not quite. Sws -800 heal boost when in dps stigmas. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Rapier-DN said:

 

Etri is right, I AM being nice and right now I am showing a hell of a lot patience. However, I can just be blunt but that won't solve anything for the other Sorcs that really DO want to try and understand where their class fits in-in the current state of the game. I'll continue to be constructive to them, but in your case, you can remain confused and ignorant. If when faced with evidence of there being other options or a better way and given proof and first hand knowledge/experience can't impart on you the wisdom to look inward and at least research how these other cats are so successful at the sorc class then that's on you.

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

1 hour ago, Etrigan-KT said:

What does it matter if it’s arena, duel or open world? Zombie is geared. I am geared. Once we are slept, pro kills us in 4 shots and if I do outplay him and get him to mess up, he can just iron clad and win. Malachyte is being nice but I’ll just straight up say it, maybe some of y’all are just boo boo. Sorcs do insane damage and can sleep to set up those combos. Add runes that give them sleep penetration and more damage and they are a disgusting class when played right.

Theres a reason he's our governor, hes an incredibly good sorc and shows how much you can accomplish by mastering your craft. But you CANNOT base your entire opinion about sorc PvP over one person. The average sorc, even a good sorc whos been playing for 1-2 years, wont EVER be able to be that good. Now if I could do that, a sorc who focuses primarily on PvE.. then yeah, we'd have a problem. But spirit masters have a fear, that cant be taken off unless its dispelled by a cleric or chanter, and sw's have a sleep as well.. I find it more broken one class is able to fear you 3 times and no matter what you do you just have to sit there and hope when it runs out youre still alive. At least with a sorc and sw sleep, the first tick of damage you take youre out of it. 

1 hour ago, Vessttemona-KT said:

The problem is not the damage a sorc can do, @Arhangelos-KT, me and others who have sorcs have said it before the problem is the defence skills that are completly outdated, and now not only that, but also nerfed, Elemental ward is a stigma with magic defense and resist which was increased from 1,000 to 1,500 (1,300 to 1,800 advance stigma), thats nice but the duration of the buff went down from 30 seconds to 15 seconds in a stigma that has 2 minutes of cd without enchant. And thundering spear, our only skill we have to heal ourselfs in pvpve, 50% of the damage done was regenerated to our hp and now will be only 20% (60% to 30% advance daevanion skill) and the increase in the damage from 559 to 587 (671 to 705 advance) seems to be really low.

Thats my issue with these nerfs, sorcs have NO defense... and if someone tries to say our 4.5k shield with a 4 min cd is good def.. well I wouldnt say so. Iron Clad is probably the only viable defense we have, and its on cool down half the time and can only really be used once in a 1v1 pvp situation or a couple times during a major boss, but the cd is so high that you have to really be in a tight situation to use it anyways. Thundering Spear is the only way that we are able to regain hp in the game without having to rely on clerics or chanters. And now they pretty much wanna make it useless. if sorc pvp is too powerful then nerf the pvp aspect, I have never once in my life, since dev skills were released, saw a sorc in full pvp skills and dev skills pick Thundering Spear over Crippling Spear.

54 minutes ago, Etrigan-KT said:

Everyone has had their life leech skills nerfed. I’ve seen geared sorcs with 22 MR with that buff and it only can go up with altar accessories. That sounds like fun for a cleric or gunner to fight... 

I understand that, but those classes can actually have good defense and can tank a few hits. Sorc is probably the weakest (defense and being able to stay alive wise) when it comes to cloth classes. SM's have their pet shields, Songweavers have their heals, vandals... god dont get me started, they have a shield that reduces 60% damage for 10 seconds, on a 1:30 cooldown, a skill that lets them live twice, healing up to 20k health AND it gives phy def, on the base skill. If you advanced that with the dev skill you can heal up to SIXTY THOUSAND HP. You dont see people having sorc as first pick to tank any major boss, you can see sin glad temp i mean seriously..

Edited by Vasilios-KT
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Etrigan-KT said:

What does it matter if it’s arena, duel or open world? Zombie is geared. I am geared. Once we are slept, pro kills us in 4 shots and if I do outplay him and get him to mess up, he can just iron clad and win. Malachyte is being nice but I’ll just straight up say it, maybe some of y’all are just boo boo. Sorcs do insane damage and can sleep to set up those combos. Add runes that give them sleep penetration and more damage and they are a disgusting class when played right.

OK, so I can also sleep someone, hit 8 skills and he still doesn't die, the "die in 4 skills" proves nothing of his ability to kill other than his insane gear, because the exact same skill sequence that he will use, I will also use but with a different outcome.

I have dark talon +15, cruel demaha accessories and +15 stigmas and +15 daevanions. Apparently he has the absolute best items in the game with the best retunes and outgears the vast majority of his enemies which is OK and there is nothing wrong with it.

If one sorc can kill you with 4 shots it means nothing for the class, otherwise every sorc should be able to hit you with 4 skills when this is clearly not the case because dmg is a matter of gear.

If my magic attack was THAT high and outgeared the m.def of the enemy, to the point that almost everyone would die to 4 ulties, then I would also be melting everyone once I would sleep them.

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

1 hour ago, Vessttemona-KT said:

The problem is not the damage a sorc can do, @Arhangelos-KT, me and others who have sorcs have said it before the problem is the defence skills that are completly outdated, and now not only that, but also nerfed, Elemental ward is a stigma with magic defense and resist which was increased from 1,000 to 1,500 (1,300 to 1,800 advance stigma), thats nice but the duration of the buff went down from 30 seconds to 15 seconds in a stigma that has 2 minutes of cd without enchant. And thundering spear, our only skill we have to heal ourselfs in pvpve, 50% of the damage done was regenerated to our hp and now will be only 20% (60% to 30% advance daevanion skill) and the increase in the damage from 559 to 587 (671 to 705 advance) seems to be really low.

Magic Defense and Physical Defense are hard stats to increase outside of short term buffs because they mitigate down TOTAL dmg of that type.  Thats why if you got the ultimate manastone verisons they will only give you like +23 to the stat vs how much you get for other stat based manastones that give like +94 outside of the atk ones. But my guess is that it isn't based off of the Magic Defense stat but because of the Magic Resist stat. 2K Magic resist on top of a 22K Magic resist set makes it hard even for those with 20k+ mag acc like myself in my full atk set to even have issues.. Of course as an SM i can just strip the buff since strips are irresistible except by skill resist skills- but for EVERY OTHER class that means a hell of time with CC like silence, aetherhold (this seems to use both evasion and magic resist at times), roots, and etc. Now imagine that being for 30s. It's a powerful buff, my guess is that you guys didn't fully realize it's potential and just now realized it could've been utilized on a good MR set. 

As for the drain skill, using just the advanced version (pointless comparing the basic version) was 705 x 3 since it's a multicast skill which is a total potency of 2,115 AND it can be cast while on the move. For comparison, the SM drain skill Backdraft isn't getting a nerf but that is because it is a 2s cast and only 1550 potency with 50% of that for heal. So 30% of 2,115 would be a heal off of 634 potency not counting crit. SM 50% heal potency on Backdraft is 775. That makes yours more in line with what your counterpart class SM have but with a reasonable deduction because it can be cast while on the move and a potential for even more if 1 or more of the multicast crits. I WISH SM drain skill was insta cast, I can't tell you how many times it pissed me off to die when trying to run to get space because of having to stop and cast that skill or worse yet dying after the cast but before the animation of the heal finished.

Edited by Malachyte-KT
Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, Vasilios-KT said:

Theres a reason he's our governor, hes an incredibly good sorc and shows how much you can accomplish by mastering your craft.

As the first Governor (and a sorc) of the Asmodian faction once the p2w Ranking was removed in early 6.5, I can reassure you, being a governor means first that you are perma geared and then obviously try religiously to get as much GP as possible. No shade, back on those 2 months that I was practically constantly governor, I tried my ass out but I was also perma geared for 6.5 (and then I decided to soft quit again especially with the implementation of the Vandal class and the nerf our class was receiving)

Right now even if I tried I probably could have been in top 5, but without the best gear in game you lack a ton when it comes to delivering dmg and thus getting on top ranks.

Our class is in the bottom tier on equal gear.

Ov3cYGS.jpg

Edited by Arhangelos-KT
Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, Arhangelos-KT said:

OK, so I can also sleep someone, hit 8 skills and he still doesn't die, the "die in 4 skills" proves nothing of his ability to kill other than his insane gear, because the exact same skill sequence that he will use, I will also use but with a different outcome.

I have dark talon +15, cruel demaha accessories and +15 stigmas and +15 daevanions. Apparently he has the absolute best items in the game with the best retunes and outgears the vast majority of his enemies which is OK and there is nothing wrong with it.

If one sorc can kill you with 4 shots it means nothing for the class, otherwise every sorc should be able to hit you with 4 skills when this is clearly not the case because dmg is a matter of gear.

If my magic attack was THAT high and outgeared the m.def of the enemy, to the point that almost everyone would die to 4 ulties, then I would also be melting everyone once I would sleep them.

He was doing that in 7.0 though as well prior to +15 stigmas and the new accessories. Fealty's alt sorc was doing that in 7.0, Vesu's half-ass playing was doing that in 7.0. The difference is that they are playing the class very different than how you guys are. My suggestion is to you is to find out what that difference is.  Accept the fact that perhaps you guys just didn't adjust to the changes to the class and your opponents in the later patches of the game vs when it was a lot easier in the earlier releases.

4 minutes ago, Arhangelos-KT said:

As the first Governor (and a sorc) of the Asmodian faction once the p2w Ranking was removed in early 6.5, I can reassure you, being a governor means first that you are perma geared and then obviously try religiously to get as much GP as possible. No shade, back on those 2 months that I was practically constantly governor, I tried my ass out but I was also perma geared for 6.5 (and then I decided to soft quit again especially with the implementation of the Vandal class and the nerf our class was receiving)

Right now even if I tried I probably could have been in top 5, but without the best gear in game you lack a ton when it comes to delivering dmg and thus getting on top ranks.

Our class is in the bottom tier on equal gear.

Ov3cYGS.jpg

According to @Rapier-DN your PvE is just fine and isn't a point of contention.. xD

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Malachyte-KT said:

He was doing that in 7.0 though as well prior to +15 stigmas and the new accessories. Fealty's alt sorc was doing that in 7.0, Vesu's half-ass playing was doing that in 7.0. The difference is that they are playing the class very different than how you guys are. My suggestion is to you is to find out what that difference is.  Accept the fact that perhaps you guys just didn't adjust to the changes to the class and your opponents in the later patches of the game vs when it was a lot easier in the earlier releases.

No no no, you said you die in 4 skills, if a sorc kills you in 4 skill this is not an ability, it is a gear difference, that is simple pure math in the dmg formula.

unknown.png

The conversation stops when you show the dmg of one sorc who happens to have it all vs an enemy who obviously doesn't How many sorcs have you seen doing this?

Pro is also finishing CS with 10 minutes left, the dmg output of his char is double than most sorcs with the typical "end game" gear. If every sorc had the exact amount of his offense then you would see every sorc doing good. He outgears most of you, 7.5 made it possible that only a handful few will have the best gear in game as long as they do 1000 runs in hard mode to get their end game gear from a pve source

7 minutes ago, Malachyte-KT said:

According to @Rapier-DN your PvE is just fine and isn't a point of contention.. xD


...yes, that was a pure reply on the guy who said that to be governor you mastered something magical when gear + effort is the only two things you need, an effort to maximize GP acquisition during siege, which is predominantly pve.

Edited by Arhangelos-KT
Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...