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If luna engine is indeed causing the problem ,can you not :

  • reduce the number of monsters that spawn ,especially crawler waves?
  • implement a new turret that takes large waves quicker ,does less damage to heroic/legendary grade Mosnters for the sake of ballance?
  • remove luna daily completely ,increase rewards for luna weekly and keep it once a week,that is to say 8 + luna's light worth of drops?
  • implement an AFK prompt window?
  • look for more ways to deal with AFKing the instance in general?

There are many solutions ,introducing more randomness inside the instance should more effectively deal with botting (if that's the case) :

  1. Waves can have mixed monsters forcing the player to fight instead of sitting with 100000 accounts opened in a corner waiting for sweet drops.
    Since you can only use your crystals to spawn 1 type of NPC turret ,the turret could target it's appropriate monster while the player gathers more
    crystals for the other type of turret.
  2. Force some sort ot IP/Mac/HDD Serial restriction on luna ,in other words duoboxing should be the only allowed way,making it harder for people to
    think of ways to run on more than 2 accounts at the same time.
  3. Not sure how people do it. But say some prefer using their 3 single shot turrets and then go afk. If that's the case ,increasing the construction cost to
    2 crystals ,while also keeping the same rate of fire ,but slightly increasing the damage to a single target could also be a solution to force the player
    to be more active rather than sit back and do whatever (which they can still do ,however risk not getting S rank).

AoE skills from luna detachment transformation are limited to hit (in worst case) only 10% of the crawlers. 

It's a difficult decision ,for us the players looks easy ,but 1 mistake can cause a riot in the forums just as we've seen most of the time.
Slightly reworking the luna daily seems the more appropriate step here.

 

Thank you so much for the EXP BUFF  !!!! :)

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The probable fix for the luna botting is making it when it first came out, where you can't get S rank from afking the instance. Since you need S rank to get the luna light which is required for all cr

1 kinah retuning npc

1 hour ago, Lerio-KT said:

If luna engine is indeed causing the problem ,can you not :

  • reduce the number of monsters that spawn ,especially crawler waves?
  • implement a new turret that takes large waves quicker ,does less damage to heroic/legendary grade Mosnters for the sake of ballance?
  • remove luna daily completely ,increase rewards for luna weekly and keep it once a week,that is to say 8 + luna's light worth of drops?
  • implement an AFK prompt window?
  • look for more ways to deal with AFKing the instance in general?

There are many solutions ,introducing more randomness inside the instance should more effectively deal with botting (if that's the case) :

  1. Waves can have mixed monsters forcing the player to fight instead of sitting with 100000 accounts opened in a corner waiting for sweet drops.
    Since you can only use your crystals to spawn 1 type of NPC turret ,the turret could target it's appropriate monster while the player gathers more
    crystals for the other type of turret.
  2. Force some sort ot IP/Mac/HDD Serial restriction on luna ,in other words duoboxing should be the only allowed way,making it harder for people to
    think of ways to run on more than 2 accounts at the same time.
  3. Not sure how people do it. But say some prefer using their 3 single shot turrets and then go afk. If that's the case ,increasing the construction cost to
    2 crystals ,while also keeping the same rate of fire ,but slightly increasing the damage to a single target could also be a solution to force the player
    to be more active rather than sit back and do whatever (which they can still do ,however risk not getting S rank).

AoE skills from luna detachment transformation are limited to hit (in worst case) only 10% of the crawlers. 

It's a difficult decision ,for us the players looks easy ,but 1 mistake can cause a riot in the forums just as we've seen most of the time.
Slightly reworking the luna daily seems the more appropriate step here.

 

Thank you so much for the EXP BUFF  !!!! :)

  • Reducing the amount of mobs that spawn could possibly fix the server NPC bug if this is what causes it, stop the crawlers from being in any wave and stop the useless 0-point mobs that also spawn along with the point-mobs.
     
  • Making a turret that makes the instance finish faster isn't going to change anything as the amount of mobs spawned seems to cause the trouble and you always need all 3 waves to finish, plus this would only help afkers and botters finish their lunas faster without even solving the "amount of NPC spawned".
     
  • Removing luna daily and making luna weekly more important with 7x the rewards of the daily is not only not helping but it is also giving botters even higher power giving them far more kinah than the actual 2~3 alt account legit players.

    ...a professional botter that has 200 accounts runs 200 accounts every day, 7x200 for the whole week.

    if you make this once per week he will run his 200 accounts on wednesday, and then on thursday he will start creating another 200 accounts to run them, when done he will make another 200 accounts to run on friday etc.
    So effectively the guy will get the same money on wednesday with his 200 accounts only, and then he will get 7 times more accounts and 7 times more money when he finally makes 1400 accounts to farm the whole week!

    So the people who have 2~5 accounts for their needs will get poorer due to inflation while those that buy kinah will get an even bigger advantage. Lastly the guys that caused the luna memory overflow will continue to overflow the memory and make 7 times more kinah now. Sure thing having 200 accounts is 7 times easier than having 1400, but professional botters do not care. Our incentive here is to make sure we do not bug the server.
     
  • AFK prompt window will most likely be automatically clicked by a bot.
     
  • To deal with afkness you need to make the game not get S-rank 4 out of 5 times while afk and A-rank 1/5 times. But again hitting the monsters will be possible with a bot, after all they are actually better at playing the game as they can tweak skills, gravity, resources and what not.
    The most important thing is that the botter will use skills against the mobs with all of his account and will get s-rank with all of them since he doesn't do it by hand. An actual legit player will eventually have to stop doing luna for his needs because doing luna 12 times per day actively is going to drive him crazy, and that is one account. So in this scenario we gave the botters exclusive kinah crafting.

***

The solutions have to be a combination of things that makes it harder for having massive accounts on one pc.

  • Limit the amount of luna instanced to 2 per IP simultaneously, when an account has prestige, the rule doesn't apply, so if a family with 3 people plays under the same IP, they can still do their thing as long as at least one has prestige or make sure they do luna at a different time of the day.

***

My last thought is... as long as there is a kinah box in the luna recipes... be 1000% sure that botters will find a way to exploit it. One way or another, they will overcome any obstacle, even better than actual players, and every nerf they implement will once again end up hurting actual players more.

Unless they remove the kinah recipe from there, which will totally destroy the luna-farmers and then actual players will have to find other ways to make kinah themselves too in which case NCWest needs to give us a way to make kinah.

Edited by Arhangelos-KT
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Siiigh..... NCSoft and papi Kibbelz, the problem here is not the luna is the Vanilla Tool thing. Just look at the Meloon event; at least 96% of the ppl who got an item there's was by beating all regular players by using the Vanilla, its become so normal now that they even brag in game about it; get some ppl playing the game and you will find all the crap they doing with it and how it will kill the game if it keeps up...... now player don't even want to run instances or help others in game do dungeon, because they selling loot they get by glide hacking using Vanilla. What NCSoft or Kibbelz needs to do is act more responsible and stop treating us the community like we are filth to them and actually spend a bit of time in game tracking those players down, when some of us actually still use real money in game (BCM) to keep you guys getting a check on your pockets .  Again luna farming is not the problem, it is Vanilla tool and the fact that you NCSoft are showing us you just don't care any more about the game or don't know what your doing any more...... I found and NPC a few days ago in Gelk who still sells crafting recipes from when Gelk first came out XD what is that doing there still when everything is supposed to be new and fixed. Give love to the players that have been playing the game the right way and take care of those screwing it to show us you still actually do care a bit for the game.

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9 minutes ago, Belty-DN said:

Siiigh..... NCSoft and papi Kibbelz, the problem here is not the luna is the Vanilla Tool thing. Just look at the Meloon event; at least 96% of the ppl who got an item there's was by beating all regular players by using the Vanilla, its become so normal now that they even brag in game about it; get some ppl playing the game and you will find all the crap they doing with it and how it will kill the game if it keeps up...... now player don't even want to run instances or help others in game do dungeon, because they selling loot they get by glide hacking using Vanilla. What NCSoft or Kibbelz needs to do is act more responsible and stop treating us the community like we are filth to them and actually spend a bit of time in game tracking those players down, when some of us actually still use real money in game (BCM) to keep you guys getting a check on your pockets .  Again luna farming is not the problem, it is Vanilla tool and the fact that you NCSoft are showing us you just don't care any more about the game or don't know what your doing any more...... I found and NPC a few days ago in Gelk who still sells crafting recipes from when Gelk first came out XD what is that doing there still when everything is supposed to be new and fixed. Give love to the players that have been playing the game the right way and take care of those screwing it to show us you still actually do care a bit for the game.

96% bots and ,3% players the rest is yet unknown LOELMAO. Calculations are gettin better with every day. Sorry I don't mean to provoke you !

 

I love melons. Got my alts geared with stones :) ,gemstone and runestone too expensive tho ,like wtf.

Edited by Lerio-KT
yes
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1 hour ago, Arhangelos-KT said:
  • Reducing the amount of mobs that spawn could possibly fix the server NPC bug if this is what causes it, stop the crawlers from being in any wave and stop the useless 0-point mobs that also spawn along with the point-mobs.
     
  • Making a turret that makes the instance finish faster isn't going to change anything as the amount of mobs spawned seems to cause the trouble and you always need all 3 waves to finish, plus this would only help afkers and botters finish their lunas faster without even solving the "amount of NPC spawned".
     
  • Removing luna daily and making luna weekly more important with 7x the rewards of the daily is not only not helping but it is also giving botters even higher power giving them far more kinah than the actual 2~3 alt account legit players.

    ...a professional botter that has 200 accounts runs 200 accounts every day, 7x200 for the whole week.

    if you make this once per week he will run his 200 accounts on wednesday, and then on thursday he will start creating another 200 accounts to run them, when done he will make another 200 accounts to run on friday etc.
    So effectively the guy will get the same money on wednesday with his 200 accounts only, and then he will get 7 times more accounts and 7 times more money when he finally makes 1400 accounts to farm the whole week!

    So the people who have 2~5 accounts for their needs will get poorer due to inflation while those that buy kinah will get an even bigger advantage. Lastly the guys that caused the luna memory overflow will continue to overflow the memory and make 7 times more kinah now. Sure thing having 200 accounts is 7 times easier than having 1400, but professional botters do not care. Our incentive here is to make sure we do not bug the server.
     
  • AFK prompt window will most likely be automatically clicked by a bot.
     
  • To deal with afkness you need to make the game not get S-rank 4 out of 5 times while afk and A-rank 1/5 times. But again hitting the monsters will be possible with a bot, after all they are actually better at playing the game as they can tweak skills, gravity, resources and what not.
    The most important thing is that the botter will use skills against the mobs with all of his account and will get s-rank with all of them since he doesn't do it by hand. An actual legit player will eventually have to stop doing luna for his needs because doing luna 12 times per day actively is going to drive him crazy, and that is one account. So in this scenario we gave the botters exclusive kinah crafting.

***

The solutions have to be a combination of things that makes it harder for having massive accounts on one pc.

  • Limit the amount of luna instanced to 2 per IP simultaneously, when an account has prestige, the rule doesn't apply, so if a family with 3 people plays under the same IP, they can still do their thing as long as at least one has prestige or make sure they do luna at a different time of the day.

***

My last thought is... as long as there is a kinah box in the luna recipes... be 1000% sure that botters will find a way to exploit it. One way or another, they will overcome any obstacle, even better than actual players, and every nerf they implement will once again end up hurting actual players more.

Unless they remove the kinah recipe from there, which will totally destroy the luna-farmers and then actual players will have to find other ways to make kinah themselves too in which case NCWest needs to give us a way to make kinah.

There are many ways to tweak the server ,and yes , it has to be some sort of combination between things.

You also need to think about the balance , you already have many players who benefited from Luna rewards,

bots or not , I'm pretty sure that you used the game of fate to make some of your fortune.  A drastic change will put

newcomers into not so favourable situation , unlike what we've had until such moment comes.

I hope they leave the the melon fanatic there for another week ,I still have bloody 1k melons to use :X

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2 hours ago, Arhangelos-KT said:
  • "... as long as there is a kinah box in the luna recipes... be 1000% sure that botters will find a way to exploit it...."

 

IMO the kinah should be in other places. Inside some medium and hard bosses. Maybe as reward if you win dredgion too. Maybe even a weekly quest about killing some random (changing) mobs in a list. 

Luna should provide usefull but not tradeable things. Like enchantments or jellys. They could even add the old skins like it used to be. 


Also I am agree with the change to weekly, or delete it and give the rewards in the weekly.  And not only for that one. Also for Abyssal Splinter. It is taking soooo long to do daily tasks, and it totally benefits people with multiaccount and bots. But is annoying for real players to repeat the same 2 things for some hours every day. 

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I think the solution to people having a massive number of accounts to farm luna etc. is to change the business model from F2P back to P2P or B2P.  If it's P2P then make it affordable eg. no more than $5US/mth. The idea is not to price gouge like the Prestige pass does, but make the money on volume.

As for all the programming suggestion, NCwest are not the programmers. The programmers are in Korea, so there is no point suggesting game changes that require coding on an NCwest forum.

Edited by Ferk-DN
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On 1/8/2021 at 7:59 PM, MechEagIe-DN said:

@Kibbelz @Loki

uXIsN7F.png

 

To anyone belive that luna only about kinah craft bundle i got surprise for you , people who bots luna instance they prefer do luna mats for after gamble in the arcade game of luna to sell enchant stone that where they kinah come from !
9veA1Jj.png

PHnTZxo.png

Vp27jqz.png

But what are the chances of pulling these items from the dice gacha?

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4 hours ago, Aelar-DN said:

Suddenly everyone is an expert on programming paradigms.

you don´t need to be an expert. You just need to know more than them. And if you check the game in the last years, it seems it is not that hard. 

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On 1/12/2021 at 10:09 PM, TheSecretCowLeve-KT said:

But what are the chances of pulling these items from the dice gacha?

I think thats his point. They bot luna so much, and have so many characters in luna all at once that these bots are getting 30-40 of these difficult to get items from the luna dice roll. They're chances aren't higher than anyone else, so clearly they must be doing it a lotttt to get that many of an item from the dice roll.

On 1/12/2021 at 6:37 PM, Ferk-DN said:

... If it's P2P then make it affordable eg. no more than $5US/mth. The idea is not to price gouge like the Prestige pass does, but make the money on volume.

As for all the programming suggestion, NCwest are not the programmers. The programmers are in Korea, so there is no point suggesting game changes that require coding on an NCwest forum.

AMEN!!! I so agree with this. If NCsoft would make this game a monthly subscription, with the promise and follow through of removing MOSTLY ALL p2w aspects of it.. id pay for it. As long as its not absurd like 50$ a month. And then on top of that monthly subscription to play the game, people can pay extra for the prestige pass or luna boxes, skins, etc. Thats the game I would LOVE to play, and would honestly pay for. 

 

As for the 2nd part, it has to be something wrong with our end. KR has bots as well, and Im sure they face the same issues. Or NCWest is doing something they're not, like not banning people or limiting something or whatever. It just says a lot that our servers are crashing due to bots, but KRs isn't when they have bots too.

Edited by Vasilios-KT
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On 1/8/2021 at 7:23 PM, Kibbelz said:

Contaminated Underpath will be disabled for a period of 1 week, from 1/13 until 1/20.

For the past several months, the team has been hard at work investigating the general instability on Katalam, which has frequently caused NPCs to lock-up and prompted us to restart the servers outside of maintenance on a weekly basis.

At this time, we believe we may have identified a cause behind the issue: the extreme usage of the Luna instance Contaminated Underpath. In order to investigate this further, we must temporarily deactivate the instance for a period of one week, from 1/13 until 1/20.

We are aware of the impact this will have on Daevas’ experience and Luna materials, so we will be adding the following:

  • Existing Luna drops in end-game instances will be increased to 5x the current amount for 1 week, from 1/13 until 1/20.
  • A +200% XP boost (3x normal XP) will be applied for 1 week, from 1/13 until 1/20. We recently shifted our plans from a single, larger short-term boost, and will now soon roll-out the following:
    • Starting this January 23rd and continuing for the indeterminate future, double XP/AP weekends are coming to Aion! From 00:00 on Saturdays until 23:59 on Sundays (server time), players will earn double XP and AP.

We apologize for the inconvenience this causes. If this test yields positive results, we will implement some changes to the instance with the goal of reducing its overall usage and impact to service stability.

So where is the double XP/AP buff that was stated we would be receiving because right now as of 11:27 am server time we have nothing.

@Kibbelz

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