Toxic p2w community will be the death of Classic

[Elpy]

What else would you expect P2W crowd to respond?

That they can't play on even grounds and helped NCSOFT ruining the game right off the bat?

Looking at responses with either "me support Aion"  or  memes about "crying more" tells you enough exactly what part of people who used to be part of Aion this sad excuse of cash grab attracted.

Finally, that part of playerbase getting wrecked when it was pay to play model with everyone playing on even grounds can get their sweet revenge by opening up them wallets and getting that sweet initial boost,  just to assure themselves that they are not a rubbish after all in the game.

Just wait till your sub is over and get out of there, don't let yourself get farmed by idiots spending hundreds and thousands on a project which was all about bringing old challenges on even grounds, yet which failed hard right at the launch.

[Gabrielis]

12 minutes ago, 2s65F09 said:

Haha talk about not being bright. Oh wait those were initially your words and you continue to insult for no reason.

Yeah and this was and will be my reply for any person who comes to forum with 12zgjdgfw86e5 nickname for a few days and starts by telling other people where they should and where they should not post and what they should and what they should not say. It is obvious for everyone that your posts make no sense and the only one who is trolling here is you. I am 31 years old, but have no idea what age are you although it doesn't matter because mental capacities are not always correlated with age. Of course I don't expect you to realize you are wrong because this would require simply too much intellectual effort from you.

A simple proof - you posted on both classic and retail forums while at the same time you don't want other to do the same. Following your "logic" I could have asked - if you quit playing retail - why you come and post on retail forums ? You simply contradicting yourself and talking nonsense. Thank you for showing to everyone a sample of Aion classic community.

It is simply too easy to come to someone with whos opinion you disagree but have no arguments other than to say he's a kid and "go away", without actually playing the game at all with a fake nickname composed of numbers and letters.

I said this and I will say it again - playing classic in a f2p way with 1-hour Siel auras resetting every day is really dumb. And if you want f2p you better quit it before you waste too much time there.

[Ashlayna-DN]

2 hours ago, Gabrielis-KT said:

You can see similar reaction on posts in this thread also, and in all classic forum. Like I said, paying money for a game where you get insulted is silly. Moderation will not work because this would require too many human ressources that they don't have, they can't even ban bots. Earlier you quit, better for you.

Let's look at how that may come about.  Let's start with the thread title, for just this thread.  The inferences are simple, if you're enjoying Classic, you're a toxic player that enjoys P2W.  Regardless of whether that's what's intended or not, it's implied.  If you dismiss the candy's impact on the game out of hand, you're a white knight, protecting your P2W investment, regardless of whether it's true or not...  There's a lot of childishness going on, from both sides of this debate, but I can see why some people might come to that.  My position is quite simple:  If the game's not living up to what you thought it was going to be, nobody is forcing you to stick with it.  Empirical "you".  So instead of polluting game chat with all the "I'm fixing to uninstall" that I've seen over the course of the last week, just uninstall, and move on.  It's not like there's no completely free version of the game available for those looking for a F2P experience.

 

"But Ash, the only people playing that are more P2W whales"?  It would seem like Aion isn't going to be the game for some people, mainly those more concerned about what others have than what they have to do to be competitive.  I can't tell you how many years I played Retail with +2 or 3 gear, missing some, or all of the manastones in it.  Yet somehow, I managed to be competitive.  I have a Rank 1 chanter that's been a 1 Star officer, a few times, and it's not even my siege toon.  Rifting, and fighting rifters was my main source of entertainment in the early days, and not just twinks, even though I had a couple of them, and this before it went F2P.

 

It's sad, to me, to read the title of this thread, and the premise behind it, only to realize that what's really adversely affecting my time in game are the players that thought they'd get everything for free here, just like in the Retail version, and are angry that they're not.  They are every bit as aggressive about it as the bots are, spam is spam, after all, and then they want to point at the people that are tired of hearing about it claiming they're toxic.  Some of them are, no doubt, but that doesn't absolve the toxicity of constantly raging that they didn't get a completely free version of Classic to play.

[Elpy]

3 minutes ago, Ashlayna-DN said:

It's sad, to me, to read the title of this thread, and the premise behind it, only to realize that what's really adversely affecting my time in game are the players that thought they'd get everything for free here, just like in the Retail version, and are angry that they're not.  They are every bit as aggressive about it as the bots are, spam is spam, after all, and then they want to point at the people that are tired of hearing about it claiming they're toxic.  Some of them are, no doubt, but that doesn't absolve the toxicity of constantly raging that they didn't get a completely free version of Classic to play.

I also was mad about people wanting it for free, that' s dumb.

Analyzing the initial gameplay model, it seemed good, actually too good to be true.

Pay 2 Play oldschool Aion on even grounds with dedicated playerbase supporting and remembering it? Nyerk, yea.

And then came candies, I am not even going to talk Daeva pass here,  if you build your game around pay to play model,  and it is pay 2 play model, f2p is just a joke with current limitations, well then don't nyerking add pay to win shop.

Why would I pay to get wrecked by people paying more?

Enchanted and manastoned gear is everything in Aion, which ruins the pvp gameplay right at the start for people not spending enough $$, therefore helping your fellow wallet warrior progress further with AP gear, which you can easily socket and ++ again as long as you spend "enough"  while blabbering how one is supporting Aion and that people should cry less.

There are no excuses, and there should be no whining of people who actually subbed for this, get the nyerk out of here and save all the frustration afterwards unless you are intending to stay in Theobomos forever.

[Gabrielis]

1 minute ago, Elpy said:

I also was mad about people wanting it for free, that' s dumb.

Analyzing the initial gameplay model, it seemed good, actually too good to be true.

Pay 2 Play oldschool Aion on even grounds with dedicated playerbase supporting and remembering it? Nyerk, yea.

And then came candies, I am not even going to talk Daeva pass here,  if you build your game around pay to play model,  and it is pay 2 play model, f2p is just a joke with current limitations, well then don't nyerking add pay to win shop.

Why would I pay to get wrecked by people paying more?

Enchanted and manastoned gear is everything in Aion, which ruins the pvp gameplay right at the start for people not spending enough $$, therefore helping your fellow wallet warrior progress further with AP gear, which you can easily socket and ++ again as long as you spend "enough"  while blabbering how one is supporting Aion and that people should cry less.

There are no excuses, and there should be no whining of people who actually subbed for this, get the nyerk out of here and save all the frustration afterwards unless you are intending to stay in Theobomos forever.

If you look at posts in this thread still you see there are much more ppl who make sense. I absolutely agree with you. We all do realize every game needs money to survive, and there can be many models how to earn money while keeping the game attractive for players. On Aion retail there is a f2p model with some p2w elements and this model is far from ideal and people complain about p2w there and they are not wrong. There may be another model  - pure subscription with a reasonable fee, and cash shop based on cosmetic items. This also makes sense, but, again, to maintain a large community, the subscription fee must be reasonable. In contrast, Aion classic model is subscription + a total p2w with candies. This makes TOTALLY no sense, so either you have to pay only for subscription and spend 24/24h farming or you have to make constant unlimited money investments to boost your progress, because in this model - more candies you buy = more kinah you have and kinah is everything in Aion 1.x, because everything can be bought with it. Paying subscription for tedious farming only to stay an average player, that doesn't sounds interesting.

And, like I said above, pure f2p players have absolutely nothing to do there, and with this point everyone (except some low-intellect individuals) will agree, f2p players on one side because 1-hour per day restriction is too penalising, and p2p players on the other hand, since many of them explicitely stated many times that they do not want f2p community there.

[Elpy]

14 hours ago, 2s65F09 said:

Why don't you crawl back under the rock from where you came from? Hint: (located here)

I'm aware you were discussing Aion Classic. When I mentioned if you didn't like how Classic is being run, you mentioned you play on retail servers. Please don't backpedal now.

Maybe you shouldn't be allowed on the internet unmonitored.

Since when someone needs some kind of permission from some random user to post on forums?

Went back to read whole topic, probably the most stupid post so far.

[2s65F09]

 

45 minutes ago, Elpy said:

Since when someone needs some kind of permission from some random user to post on forums?

Went back to read whole topic, probably the most stupid post so far.

Since he can talk to me how he wants, I can talk to him how I want.

Takes one to know one.

Grow up and get back to the topic instead of personally attacking me. Kthxbye.

[Gabrielis]

20 minutes ago, 2s65F09 said:

 

Since he can talk to me how he wants, I can talk to him how I want.

Takes one to know one.

Grow up and get back to the topic instead of personally attacking me. Kthxbye.

But it was you who replied on my post with “why you are here” first, in case you have bad memory just scroll the posts up. I never had any intention to talk to you at first place, but I was bound to reply to your outrageous attacks. It’s clear that you have negative IQ and with your every reply you are contradicting yourself more and more and look ridiculous telling everyone to grow up. Maybe it is you who is a child in fact.

[Ashlayna-DN]

5 hours ago, Gabrielis-KT said:

If you look at posts in this thread still you see there are much more ppl who make sense. I absolutely agree with you. We all do realize every game needs money to survive, and there can be many models how to earn money while keeping the game attractive for players. On Aion retail there is a f2p model with some p2w elements and this model is far from ideal and people complain about p2w there and they are not wrong. There may be another model  - pure subscription with a reasonable fee, and cash shop based on cosmetic items. This also makes sense, but, again, to maintain a large community, the subscription fee must be reasonable. In contrast, Aion classic model is subscription + a total p2w with candies. This makes TOTALLY no sense, so either you have to pay only for subscription and spend 24/24h farming or you have to make constant unlimited money investments to boost your progress, because in this model - more candies you buy = more kinah you have and kinah is everything in Aion 1.x, because everything can be bought with it. Paying subscription for tedious farming only to stay an average player, that doesn't sounds interesting.

And, like I said above, pure f2p players have absolutely nothing to do there, and with this point everyone (except some low-intellect individuals) will agree, f2p players on one side because 1-hour per day restriction is too penalising, and p2p players on the other hand, since many of them explicitely stated many times that they do not want f2p community there.

I don't think it's limiting enough.  There was a free trial period, either pay the sub and play, or go over the totally free version.

[Ashlayna-DN]

5 hours ago, Elpy said:

I also was mad about people wanting it for free, that' s dumb.

Analyzing the initial gameplay model, it seemed good, actually too good to be true.

Pay 2 Play oldschool Aion on even grounds with dedicated playerbase supporting and remembering it? Nyerk, yea.

And then came candies, I am not even going to talk Daeva pass here,  if you build your game around pay to play model,  and it is pay 2 play model, f2p is just a joke with current limitations, well then don't nyerking add pay to win shop.

Why would I pay to get wrecked by people paying more?

Enchanted and manastoned gear is everything in Aion, which ruins the pvp gameplay right at the start for people not spending enough $$, therefore helping your fellow wallet warrior progress further with AP gear, which you can easily socket and ++ again as long as you spend "enough"  while blabbering how one is supporting Aion and that people should cry less.

There are no excuses, and there should be no whining of people who actually subbed for this, get the nyerk out of here and save all the frustration afterwards unless you are intending to stay in Theobomos forever.

Since I went over most of this in my previous post, paying or not, it won't matter.  Late game, we're all going to be hitting the kinah cap to the vendors just selling rubbish drops, which will help level the field.  No matter what, there's lucky people, and unlucky people, and RNG will still win the day.

[Lezyria]

On 7/2/2021 at 3:25 PM, Gabrielis-KT said:

In fact, there are 3 kinds of population on classic, based on my experience during the first week, - 1) like you said - people who quit retail a while ago and came back to classic, 2) people who are playing retail atm and also trying classic now and 3) new players with no experience in Aion who came play classic straight away.

you are forgetting a 4th kind..... old aion players that gave up the game many years ago when it started to suck balls and wanted to revive that old experience, but alas life priorities cant make them afford for a sub currently and they feel bad for having stuff reduced as a free player (when what should be done is to give bonuses to those that pay, instead of paying a sub to "unblock basic content").
i paied sub to get things done at start, i dont really care about candies or whatnot, but i do find ridiculous that we have to pay a sub and then on top of that we still have almost "essential" stuff on the shop as well and feel forced to spend even more money......
as for the talks ingame or in the forums about the elitist paying deminishing the free players, keep one thing in mind guys, free players also count into server population, you really want to keep the few hundred subs and players in your server and make ncsoft decide its not worth to waste money to keep a server active? or do you prefer free players that add into population numbers and although theu dont pay sub, they might still buy something from shop and help the company have a reason to keep servers active with thousands of players that are spending some money, rather than a few hundred sub payers?
Stop trashing free players, you must think in the population numbers rather than anything else, otherwise this 12 year old game will die permanently, it wont be the few sub payers that would hold the server profitable to keep it active, i tell you......

[Elpy]

18 hours ago, Ashlayna-DN said:

Since I went over most of this in my previous post, paying or not, it won't matter.  Late game, we're all going to be hitting the kinah cap to the vendors just selling rubbish drops, which will help level the field.  No matter what, there's lucky people, and unlucky people, and RNG will still win the day.

You should know well enough, that in MMORPGS large part is the road to the goal, not the goal itself what matters.

People talk about endgame like it is all what matters, no it is not. Wasnt the low/mid lvl PvP rifting and abyss large part of the selling point? Do you believe people not paying $$ have even grounds now vs people dumping cash on it?

Next, as I pointed out, people gaining initial advantage will hold it all the way till endgame, having manastoned and enchanted gear helps one further to have an upper hand in pvp to progress with abyss gear, which you can enchant again before regular people catching up.

And endgame? Sure, by the time you will catch up, there will be new patch, new gear, with which you will again lag behind while enchanting/manastoning, not being able to afford the godstones, it will be never ending cycle of catching up to people paying their way through.

Now no, it is not absolutely gamebreaking, and I am not going to be the guy yelling game's dead, but to tell "this is fine", no it isn't.

It is cheap cash grab and the moment candies will become ineffective enough, surely NCsoft will find a new way to sell new stuff to people paying.

Seeing how this launched, you can be pretty sure they will keep milking pay 2 win community the same all the way through game. People defending  this and buying from them are their best encouragement to do so.

And then if you chose to be not part of that bs, yet you will still have to pay them for sub to play the game  without all the made up limitations after one hour, so people paying more can nyerk with you like that?

Well to each their own I guess, I see this as nothing but greedy move right off the bat, solely sub based pay to play with some cosmetic stuff in shop would have been great, this however is just bs, and the only people defending it will be the ones buying candies while telling how it is not a big deal. Yea right, yet they buy them while trying to weasel their way around it.

A lie repeated a thousand times becomes truth, not gonna be part of that, thanks.

[Gabrielis]

4 hours ago, Lezyria said:

you are forgetting a 4th kind..... old aion players that gave up the game many years ago when it started to suck balls and wanted to revive that old experience, but alas life priorities cant make them afford for a sub currently and they feel bad for having stuff reduced as a free player (when what should be done is to give bonuses to those that pay, instead of paying a sub to "unblock basic content").
i paied sub to get things done at start, i dont really care about candies or whatnot, but i do find ridiculous that we have to pay a sub and then on top of that we still have almost "essential" stuff on the shop as well and feel forced to spend even more money......
as for the talks ingame or in the forums about the elitist paying deminishing the free players, keep one thing in mind guys, free players also count into server population, you really want to keep the few hundred subs and players in your server and make ncsoft decide its not worth to waste money to keep a server active? or do you prefer free players that add into population numbers and although theu dont pay sub, they might still buy something from shop and help the company have a reason to keep servers active with thousands of players that are spending some money, rather than a few hundred sub payers?
Stop trashing free players, you must think in the population numbers rather than anything else, otherwise this 12 year old game will die permanently, it wont be the few sub payers that would hold the server profitable to keep it active, i tell you......

it was number 1 in my list, but you added some more precisions to it. Me too I was like you, I stopped playing retail for a while and I came back after covid pandemic started, and when I came back to retail I was disgusted at first because that was a totally different game and I found myself almost naked without any gear, any enchanted stigmas and 0 daevanion skills (because when I was playing daevanion skills didn't even exist). However, I was attached to the character I made back in 2012 so I decided to give it a try. And with time I found this game quite amusing and now, when I made my progress there I totally don't feel like returning to classic. On retail I can play my class without any need of mana or HP pots, and the new transformation system (altho it has serious drawbacks and I don't agree with it) requires you to use only 1 scroll where in old Aion you had to use many - awakening, running, resist scrolls, etc. and you can use a minion to auto-buff you and auto-loot.

I had my doze of nostalgia finishing Verteron campaign during the 1st trial week but that's it for me. I totally feel what you feel about candies and you basically speak my words - this game model is toxic because it requires from you to pay more and more and more,  - 1st subscription without which you cannot play (sadomasochists who want to play with 1 hour Siel aura per day, please pass your way), 2nd - daeva pass because it may help you to struggle less, 3rd - candies to get kinah. I personally find this kinda scary, because on retail it is I who decide when to spend money and on what, and if I don't feel like spending money on it, I still have my char and I can play. On classic I can not.

And I also agree with you - f2p players are also needed because they help to make game community sustainable. Within f2p model, new gamers can come to the game easier because they don't have to spend money to try it and they relize if they don't like it they can quit. However, here on classic, f2p players are restricted so that they cannot play at all, that means that the company don't want them to be there and encourages paying the sub. On the other hand, subscription players don't want f2p players to be there, many of them stated this. That's why, if you want f2p Aion - it's either play retail or quit. No point wasting your time on Classic.

[Ashlayna-DN]

4 hours ago, Elpy said:

You should know well enough, that in MMORPGS large part is the road to the goal, not the goal itself what matters.

People talk about endgame like it is all what matters, no it is not. Wasnt the low/mid lvl PvP rifting and abyss large part of the selling point? Do you believe people not paying $$ have even grounds now vs people dumping cash on it?

Next, as I pointed out, people gaining initial advantage will hold it all the way till endgame, having manastoned and enchanted gear helps one further to have an upper hand in pvp to progress with abyss gear, which you can enchant again before regular people catching up.

And endgame? Sure, by the time you will catch up, there will be new patch, new gear, with which you will again lag behind while enchanting/manastoning, not being able to afford the godstones, it will be never ending cycle of catching up to people paying their way through.

Now no, it is not absolutely gamebreaking, and I am not going to be the guy yelling game's dead, but to tell "this is fine", no it isn't.

It is cheap cash grab and the moment candies will become ineffective enough, surely NCsoft will find a new way to sell new stuff to people paying.

Seeing how this launched, you can be pretty sure they will keep milking pay 2 win community the same all the way through game. People defending  this and buying from them are their best encouragement to do so.

And then if you chose to be not part of that bs, yet you will still have to pay them for sub to play the game  without all the made up limitations after one hour, so people paying more can nyerk with you like that?

Well to each their own I guess, I see this as nothing but greedy move right off the bat, solely sub based pay to play with some cosmetic stuff in shop would have been great, this however is just bs, and the only people defending it will be the ones buying candies while telling how it is not a big deal. Yea right, yet they buy them while trying to weasel their way around it.

A lie repeated a thousand times becomes truth, not gonna be part of that, thanks.

No, I don't believe they're paying to have "even grounds", especially not in Aion, if they're playing Asmodian.  I sieged in Retail when the Elyos had as many people guarding a teleporter as we had for the siege.  I played when 2 Asmos fighting an entire alliance of Elyos was called a zerg, by the Elyos.  I paid to play the game, and playing it is what I'm doing.  I'm not struggling to get by in low level content, which would suck, since all I have are low levels.  But endgame is the goal.  PvPing on the way to end game is a means to an end, 50E AP gear, that, no matter how much raging gets done in game, or here, can be purchased for kinah.  No amount of Kinah is going to guarantee socketing, or enhancements, it just gives one more stones to fail on the way.

 

The amount of money spent by Player Y, or player y in the other faction is going to change why I play the game, and I believe that it's pretty safe to say that I'm not the only one.   I just finished blowing through just under 200k on my level 17 now assassin, no candies required, getting my tailoring up to 100 and change, so I could craft a set of armor that I liked.  Reaching for my wallet never even occurred to me.  I'm getting to the point where I sincerely believe that all the people that are constantly raging about candies are being paid by the kinah spammers, afraid that they'll be put out of work.  It's the only conceivable way the same player could have been constantly raging about it for 14 hours yesterday, that I'm aware of.

[Elpy]

1 hour ago, Ashlayna-DN said:

No, I don't believe they're paying to have "even grounds", especially not in Aion, if they're playing Asmodian.  I sieged in Retail when the Elyos had as many people guarding a teleporter as we had for the siege.  I played when 2 Asmos fighting an entire alliance of Elyos was called a zerg, by the Elyos.  I paid to play the game, and playing it is what I'm doing.  I'm not struggling to get by in low level content, which would suck, since all I have are low levels.  But endgame is the goal.  PvPing on the way to end game is a means to an end, 50E AP gear, that, no matter how much raging gets done in game, or here, can be purchased for kinah.  No amount of Kinah is going to guarantee socketing, or enhancements, it just gives one more stones to fail on the way.

 

The amount of money spent by Player Y, or player y in the other faction is going to change why I play the game, and I believe that it's pretty safe to say that I'm not the only one.   I just finished blowing through just under 200k on my level 17 now assassin, no candies required, getting my tailoring up to 100 and change, so I could craft a set of armor that I liked.  Reaching for my wallet never even occurred to me.  I'm getting to the point where I sincerely believe that all the people that are constantly raging about candies are being paid by the kinah spammers, afraid that they'll be put out of work.  It's the only conceivable way the same player could have been constantly raging about it for 14 hours yesterday, that I'm aware of.

Good for you, and I am happy you enjoy the game the way it is. I just know, I won't.

[Ashlayna-DN]

46 minutes ago, Elpy said:

Good for you, and I am happy you enjoy the game the way it is. I just know, I won't.

Thanks.  The good news is, you don't have torture yourself with it, if you find you're not liking it.  While I don't share your viewpoint, it is your viewpoint to have, and if you feel like it's taking away from your experience, you're not required to stick around.

[Elpy]

21 minutes ago, Ashlayna-DN said:

Thanks.  The good news is, you don't have torture yourself with it, if you find you're not liking it.  While I don't share your viewpoint, it is your viewpoint to have, and if you feel like it's taking away from your experience, you're not required to stick around.

Thanks, it is relieving to realize you can disagree without being rude or try to convince other person they are wrong.

I quit Aion once I realized the whole candy BS, surely did enjoy running around Vert and Elthen till it lasted

I would not be here at this point if not for the attitude of "stop crying", "it's normal for games to be p2w"crowd, the pinnacle was someone threatening to report someone not happy about the current game model to mods after talking  crapload of nyerk to him..I reported him and thread got deleted afterwards.

If anything, the worst reputation Aion will get is from this kind of people who simply confirm with their replies how nyerked up the whole deal is.

[Razsyl]

 

The absolute state of whales in Aion classic lul.

[Ashlayna-DN]

14 hours ago, Elpy said:

Thanks, it is relieving to realize you can disagree without being rude or try to convince other person they are wrong.

I quit Aion once I realized the whole candy BS, surely did enjoy running around Vert and Elthen till it lasted

I would not be here at this point if not for the attitude of "stop crying", "it's normal for games to be p2w"crowd, the pinnacle was someone threatening to report someone not happy about the current game model to mods after talking  crapload of nyerk to him..I reported him and thread got deleted afterwards.

If anything, the worst reputation Aion will get is from this kind of people who simply confirm with their replies how nyerked up the whole deal is.

I think more people will read the forums and go "yep, it's an MMO forum".   In the general sense, I could transplant threads from GW 2 to here, and if I did a lot of editing to remove the game/publisher, no-one would notice.  I could do the same with ESO.  it's hilarious to me, the things that are considered P2W in GW 2, for example, things like paid expansions, and inventory space, right down to cosmetic outfits.

 

When I compare that to something like Rappelz, where the primary source for items that are going to be required for gear enchantment are locked in cash shop, it really does frustrate me to no end.  This starts being less about P2W, and more about "but they have it, and I want it".  When I read things like "even ground" in this topic, I have to laugh.  If there was no cash shop at all, there would be no even ground.  I know people that get their RNG drops on the first couple of tries.  I ran the Asmo's high level extendable weapon dungeon every week for a year and a half, and never got my extendable weapons.  That right there means that equity/equal ground, is out of the realm of possibility.

[Lezyria]

7 hours ago, Razsyl said:

 

The absolute state of whales in Aion classic lul.

sure, we all gonna skip meals now, like if we are all kids under allowances......
some people have a family to sustain, bills to pay, cars to put petrol and pay insurances, 15$ a month can make a big difference, and not worth to spend it on a game if all it gives is the "basic functions" of said game, because you are forced to pay it if you want to progress, since being a free player you are taken away those basic functions.....
it is wrong, it is expensive. as i mentioned before, for a free game, subs should give bonuses to paying players, not taking away from free ones, and there is a big more modern competition that has cheaper subs for their "vip plan" or whatever you want to call it.
but yeah, those kind of people that come with that talk that is all fine, can only be spoiled brats that get their allowance and can afford to skip meals or other stuff without worrying much. i bet no true aion veteran player, that by now has a stablished life and knows how money works properly, would have that kind of talk.

[Lezyria]

3 minutes ago, Ashlayna-DN said:

 This starts being less about P2W, and more about "but they have it, and I want it". 

spoiled brats everywhere i say...... and those that can pay it, find nonsense excuses like mentioned above, "its just 15$, skip a meal"...... wtf, who in its decent mind will skip A MEAL...... so nonsense talk from small brains, sorry if i am rude but thats all that it sounds..... kids everywhere, on both free or subbing sides, complaining without giving the proper justifications to whats is wrong, but just pointing fingers "you can but i cant".....

[Ashlayna-DN]

1 minute ago, Lezyria said:

spoiled brats everywhere i say...... and those that can pay it, find nonsense excuses like mentioned above, "its just 15$, skip a meal"...... wtf, who in its decent mind will skip A MEAL...... so nonsense talk from small brains, sorry if i am rude but thats all that it sounds..... kids everywhere, on both free or subbing sides, complaining without giving the proper justifications to whats is wrong, but just pointing fingers "you can but i cant".....

While I'm not prone to rubbish talking, I took the meaning to be a bit different.  I don't spend 15 bucks on most meals I prepare at home, but I might spend that going out to eat.  Usually, when players in an mmo are complaining about a sub, "don't go out to eat one time" is the counter argument.  I can't pretend to know that poster's motivations, or meaning, but that's my interpretation of the comment.  It's certainly what I have to do if I'm going to maintain a sub, in any MMO.

[Lezyria]

Ashlayna-DN more you are helping me, being a family provider. 15$ provides for several meals, not just one, it makes a big difference to a household, not like some brats say that its nothing, its cheap and so on.....
and due all the bloody situation we all gone through with covid, there are also many families that ran out of work and collected debt, and are now trying to recover that debt and will not afford 15$ for a game as well (fortunately not my situation, i have been working all the way through).
even for blade&Soul the "membership" is 10$ and is a far more recent game, and they want us to pay 15 for aion?
and no chance to make it an "option", since a free player is so completely borked of doing anything without it?
grind for the double hours due the half xp mobs give, not able to gather stuff to craft later (must gather during the seal duration as well, taking out lvling time), no ap drop whatsoever, not even from a simple quest reward even as a free player, unless the seal is active.... we are FORCED to play with the seal to get the basic stuff of the game....
on free to play games all over, subs are to give bonuses, not to unlock content....