[Survey] Israphel Asmodian Survey

[Forthyn]

"60k+ players" ..... isn't server cap around 5,000? Genuine question, I tried looking it up prior to posting this.
 

Quote

There hasn't been a log-in queue for EITHER server since day 1 when they staggered logins with the intentional queue.

 

[Forthyn]

14 hours ago, HeartStrings-DN said:

This chart only serves to keep the asmos dominance and try and make Siel Elyos look bad that's it .   

We know there is significant number difference and I would guess at siege time Asmos probably have more people in PVE and crafting rooms.

1. Because your present performance leaves much to be desired. We both know this.

2. For you:
- Krotan siege - 7/19
Asmos in Pandaemonium: 203
Elyos in Sanctum: 194

[Arazith-IS]

31 minutes ago, Forthyn - Asmodaes Pea-k said:

"60k+ players" ..... isn't server cap around 5,000? Genuine question, I tried looking it up prior to posting this.
 

 

According to myaion.eu; Siel has ~50% cap and IS has ~20%, if we use Siege as peak times, I would guess around 6k is 100%.

[Ashlayna-DN]

On 7/16/2021 at 12:40 PM, Vantheria-DN said:

Yeah. Because there are about 100 of them. TOTAL. So I'm sorry about your little spy game or whatever, but retail does not have the population to support two separate servers. It's nearly impossible for people to form groups for anything endgame. We aren't talking about Classic as that's not what's being merged. We're talking about retail.

Except that "they need to merge classic" was very much what was being discussed, which is unsurprising, since it comes up every day in LFG, there's even a character with the name "ServerMerge", and because we're in the Classic forum.  I've been logged in to retail recently, even the gold spammers were absent.  If you want to discuss retail, there's another forum specifically set up for that.

 

On 7/15/2021 at 11:11 PM, Arhangelos-KT said:

Not to sound rude but "the leadership quit"? Who are they, the government or something? Nobody crowns anyone a leader which you are mandated to follow. Nor does their effort to reach end game status fast and gear themselves belong to the faction.

This is not socialism where you are obliged to participate and share. There are people who simple do pve and others who do only twinking, these also do not contribute as much as end game users, can they be blamed for enjoying the game the way they want? Each to their own and nobody can blame anyone for anything.

Someone might be 50 and geared and not feel like going to a siege for any reason. Statistically if the numbers were equal there would be balance, if there is no balance then there is smoke and wherever is smoke there is a fire.

So who's supposed to lead those that are willing to participate in sieges?  Were you one of the people deriding the people that at least stepped up to try, while linking your blue Kromede weapons?

[Forthyn]

1 hour ago, Arazith-IS said:

According to myaion.eu; Siel has ~50% cap and IS has ~20%, if we use Siege as peak times, I would guess around 6k is 100%.

Thank you

[Arhangelos]

3 hours ago, Ashlayna-DN said:

So who's supposed to lead those that are willing to participate in sieges?  Were you one of the people deriding the people that at least stepped up to try, while linking your blue Kromede weapons?

...no I didn't play actively on IS because it is dead. I just made my char there played a while and saw it is empty. The phrase "the leaders quit" is wrong, anyone can lead a siege if they want to.

It is like "the leaders" were some sort of company employees and they quit leaving the server without a necessary feature of the game.

[Ashlayna-DN]

4 hours ago, Arhangelos-KT said:

...no I didn't play actively on IS because it is dead. I just made my char there played a while and saw it is empty. The phrase "the leaders quit" is wrong, anyone can lead a siege if they want to.

It is like "the leaders" were some sort of company employees and they quit leaving the server without a necessary feature of the game.

Anyone can, but who's going to?  So you don't play here, but you're wise to what's going on?  The people that were willing to step up and actually lead, instead of talking about it quit doing it.  Whether they quit the game or not is irrelevant, they quit trying to lead, with the end result being that nobody stepped up to fill the void, despite all the "well, I can do it better".

 

So yeah, anyone can, but what happens when no one will?  Here's an example:  "we need a server merge".

[Foenix]

On 7/18/2021 at 7:45 PM, Forthyn - Asmodaes Pea-k said:

Then start working together and get people out of PVE instances and the Crafting rooms in Sanctum, there was literally no reason for Elyos to have lost out on the fort tonight.

It isn't a numbers issue, it's a cooperation issue. Get over your excuses.
 

It's funny because this gets quoted to fit the whims of people who want to prove there is no imbalance on Siel and ignored when people want to claim no imbalance on Israphael. 

The last time i saw this posted on IS was ~1-2 weeks ago and there was a 50% imbalance.  Adjust for bots which can be assumed to be approximately the same and it's worse.  

Currently there sits 1164 players on Israphael.  Assuming the numbers have stayed the same (which is unlikely considering the number of players who used 100% exp to leave for siel).  There is around ~450 Asmodian, and ~650 Elyos.  For easy lets remove 50 bots from both sides.  400 v 600.  Now lets remove <25 or players otherwise occupied, afk crafting, unavailable for the siege.  200 v 400 - 300 v 500.  You cannot claim balance when the numbers literally show 2:1 availability on participation.  This goes without factoring morale which would have an opposite effect depending on your factions performance.  when losing your faction is less motivated to attend, when winning they are more motivated.

Best guess the Israphael Asmodians have a pool of about 150-250 players any given night to pull from for Sieges.  Whereas the Elyos have 350-450.

The IS Asmodians aren't "boycotting" until NCSoft does something.  That may be how it's been presented by self righteous players.  The IS Asmodians who have decided not to re-roll are simply choosing to use their time better than to smash ourselves into a 2:1 fight for the Elyos amusement.  We hope NCSoft will be smart enough to do something before too many players move on to something else but doubt they will.  At the end of the day this game is appealing primarily to nostalgia for older gamers.  And has to compete with newer games that are being released as time goes on.  I've already had 3 genuinely new players to Aion quit the game for the new season of PoE and the new battle royale mode and 1 quit for WoW because despite me convincing all of them to TRY Aion because IMO it had what they all want in an MMO they were unconvinced after weeks of the imbalance.  Nostalgic players may hold on longer but after dealing with this once in retail... i doubt by much.  

NCSoft can do nothing, it's their game.  But it isn't the smart business choice and fixing the issues of imbalance, or at least trying to in a MEANINGFUL WAY, not some shit survey. Isn't giving in to some boycott that doesn't exist.  

[Arhangelos]

2 hours ago, Ashlayna-DN said:

Anyone can, but who's going to?  So you don't play here, but you're wise to what's going on?  The people that were willing to step up and actually lead, instead of talking about it quit doing it.  Whether they quit the game or not is irrelevant, they quit trying to lead, with the end result being that nobody stepped up to fill the void, despite all the "well, I can do it better".

So yeah, anyone can, but what happens when no one will?  Here's an example:  "we need a server merge".

 

• Some players tried to siege, failed and then never showed up again
• Some players tried to siege, failed and they rerolled on SL
• Some players didn't try to siege at all

The "leaders" didn't quit, a leader is not a title someone has exclusively. It is just high leveled chars with gears that tried to take forts in the first sieges stopped showing up and some rerolled.

We are beating a dead horse here and we are playing with words.

[Ele-DN]

3 hours ago, Ashlayna-DN said:

Anyone can, but who's going to?  So you don't play here, but you're wise to what's going on?  The people that were willing to step up and actually lead, instead of talking about it quit doing it.  Whether they quit the game or not is irrelevant, they quit trying to lead, with the end result being that nobody stepped up to fill the void, despite all the "well, I can do it better".

 

So yeah, anyone can, but what happens when no one will?  Here's an example:  "we need a server merge".

Not really. They need to pass a test before even attempting to lead.

[Arhangelos]

25 minutes ago, Ele-DN said:

Not really. They need to pass a test before even attempting to lead.

[Forthyn]

3 hours ago, Foenix said:

It's funny because this gets quoted to fit the whims of people who want to prove there is no imbalance on Siel and ignored when people want to claim no imbalance on Israphael. 

The last time i saw this posted on IS was ~1-2 weeks ago and there was a 50% imbalance.  Adjust for bots which can be assumed to be approximately the same and it's worse.  

The IS Asmodians aren't "boycotting" until NCSoft does something.  That may be how it's been presented by self righteous players.  The IS Asmodians who have decided not to re-roll are simply choosing to use their time better than to smash ourselves into a 2:1 fight for the Elyos amusement.  We hope NCSoft will be smart enough to do something before too many players move on to something else but doubt they will.  At the end of the day this game is appealing primarily to nostalgia for older gamers.  And has to compete with newer games that are being released as time goes on.  I've already had 3 genuinely new players to Aion quit the game for the new season of PoE and the new battle royale mode and 1 quit for WoW because despite me convincing all of them to TRY Aion because IMO it had what they all want in an MMO they were unconvinced after weeks of the imbalance.  Nostalgic players may hold on longer but after dealing with this once in retail... i doubt by much.  

NCSoft can do nothing, it's their game.  But it isn't the smart business choice and fixing the issues of imbalance, or at least trying to in a MEANINGFUL WAY, not some shit survey. Isn't giving in to some boycott that doesn't exist.  

My words were for the Siel Elyos player only, a faction we know to be working through a leadership and coordination issue. Last night Siel Elyos pulled nearly 500 players in the Abyss which was more than they’ve ever done, and I fully expect that number to continue growing as I watch the level brackets scale upwards and more people are getting involved with the faction. 

 

The same cannot be said for Israphel, especially not now. I was applying “boycott” to the Israphel siege chart because that was exactly how it was presented by certain vocal members who can be seen as toxic to the IS community, and that’s how Israphel players told it to me and those reading the faction chat see it. If you look at my recent charts, I now have it labeled “internal focus”, because that is what key members of the community are coming together to do; I have friends helping me keep tabs on what is going on, but know that I do appreciate your words here. 

The damage has already been done by those who were negative about the server’s performance, and some would rather see it burn than be part of the solution. It’s presently an uphill battle, that’s for sure. 

[Kubei-DN]

Every time I look into IS-A LFG regarding siege, there's always some sort of excuse to not go siege. At this point they're just hindering progress for themselves and the rest of the faction.

[Ashlayna-DN]

3 hours ago, Arhangelos-KT said:

 

• Some players tried to siege, failed and then never showed up again
• Some players tried to siege, failed and they rerolled on SL
• Some players didn't try to siege at all

The "leaders" didn't quit, a leader is not a title someone has exclusively. It is just high leveled chars with gears that tried to take forts in the first sieges stopped showing up and some rerolled.

We are beating a dead horse here and we are playing with words.

No, I'm legit trying to figure out the difference between quit trying and quit.  You say neither applies, I say it doesn't matter which is more accurate, when there's a void trying to light a spark.  I'm also saying this from the standpoint of someone that actually plays on the server, and shows up for sieges, when I'm online.  My first siege I was literally cannon fodder, a fresh 25 with no gear to speak of, but it's part of what I liked about this game way back when, and so, I participate.

 

2 hours ago, Ele-DN said:

Not really. They need to pass a test before even attempting to lead.

I hope it's not given by the FT PvP heroes???

[HeartStrings-DN]

On 7/19/2021 at 3:08 PM, Arhangelos-KT said:

Isn't it funny how elyos are either

• Very good at sieging tactics (when they outnumber the Asmodians and win on IS)
• Outnumbered and need help (when they are equal in numbers but don't participate on Siel)

The charts show the numbers, not the dedication of each faction. And yes there could be some gear imbalance but that will fix itself.

You have to keep in mind that the chart was made by an asmo manually then asking you to take his word for it the numbers are correct.  Secondly how many asmos have created an account with an elyos character also and logs in afk .  If you like the numbers look no further than the in game number of ratio of influence the Elyos have which is "0" or look at the number of times they have taken a fortress since classic started.   It alright if you want to keep this imbalance going in favor of the asmos but when the game is destroyed because the Elyos are tired of going to siege for nothing then good for you just ruin another good game.

[Arazith-IS]

39 minutes ago, HeartStrings-DN said:

You have to keep in mind that the chart was made by an asmo manually then asking you to take his word for it the numbers are correct.  Secondly how many asmos have created an account with an elyos character also and logs in afk .  If you like the numbers look no further than the in game number of ratio of influence the Elyos have which is "0" or look at the number of times they have taken a fortress since classic started.   It alright if you want to keep this imbalance going in favor of the asmos but when the game is destroyed because the Elyos are tired of going to siege for nothing then good for you just ruin another good game.

All that "0" influence tells you is that Elyos were unable to cap a fort, nothing else. It doesn't say how many are online, were even in the Abyss, or just crafting in Sanctum or PVEing. Forthyn's chart (which anyone can verify if they want to collect that data at the same time), paints more of the picture of what could be happening. If you want to refute the numbers, by all means start presenting your own to actually back up your claims. 

[Squid]

1 hour ago, Arazith-IS said:

All that "0" influence tells you is that Elyos were unable to cap a fort, nothing else. It doesn't say how many are online, were even in the Abyss, or just crafting in Sanctum or PVEing. Forthyn's chart (which anyone can verify if they want to collect that data at the same time), paints more of the picture of what could be happening. If you want to refute the numbers, by all means start presenting your own to actually back up your claims. 

Yea exactly, What forth does is good it shows numbers are far closer than you think it is just a bit of the elyos playstyles.

Example: I would say 60-70% of the clerics i have met are DPS clerics, Worried about contribution before actually capping a fort. You can sit down next to the healers and pot/heal up w/o getting a heal. 

There is far more than this going on as well. As an example: I counted those who were afk one siege in reshanta/doing the lower fort repeats(because asmos are pre-occupied) and we had 118 elyos in reshanta not participating in siege many of which were 40+. They would rather fight and try and KS each other over mobs on a bridge(legitimately 3 groups on the same bridge). Than turn up for siege. 

Ultimately Asmo's like PvP more than elyos that is abundantly clear with how many times they come back over and over and over while elyos quit after a single group member dying to an asmo.

[Ele-DN]

7 hours ago, Arhangelos-KT said:

Theres no troll here. Would you join and help someone who stole from you? rubbish talk? screwed you in some way? 

 

If they were to lead, and did the above to many others, how would that go? Would it be easy to get people to trust them with lead? Remember 5.8 or around there where you were forced into collations and if you had issues with them, they would kick? Theres these 2 famous  "leaders" that did that and screwed themselves later in 6.0 because they had no power for being dicks.

[Rakionrql]

On 7/18/2021 at 9:44 PM, Arazith-IS said:

The servers have different problems and shouldn't be compared to each other imo. Elyos on Siel just looks like they flat out aren't participating but have the numbers to be able to compete. Most counts are showing that total people that are online for each faction are around 1500, with Asmos having slightly more(1600+ A: 1500+ E).

On Israphel, while they had the numbers to be competitive at first, have actually lost numbers, likely in part to people like you who are saying people should just come on over...Latest sieges on IS have one side with 50% more total online than the other (600+ E : 400+ A).

At no point did the elyos on Is have close to 600 ppl for siege.  At peak week one maybe 200 elyos sieged. But thats a stretch. Now its like 140 elyos at a siege on IS. 
 

no clue what IS siege numbers for asmos are bc they dont try anymore. 

[Nitro]

i appriciate the try, but the content of the survey was not really much and nowhere close to an argument to play on IS asmo. we need better than that. i created a char on siel and their lfg is really full with grp searches. on is asmo you sometimes look 2h for people, and still cannot find a grp for adma or bakarma (and i am playing cleric!). really frustrating.

[Rakionrql]

6 minutes ago, Nitro said:

i appriciate the try, but the content of the survey was not really much and nowhere close to an argument to play on IS asmo. we need better than that. i created a char on siel and their lfg is really full with grp searches. on is asmo you sometimes look 2h for people, and still cannot find a grp for adma or bakarma (and i am playing cleric!). really frustrating.

Cross server instance queueing would fix some things. 
 

also should offer some kind of crazy leveling incentive to is asmos. And lock siel asmo creation until numbers from elyos are even. 

[Vicdus]

9 minutes ago, Rakionrql said:

Cross server instance queueing would fix some things. 
 

 

So much this, bringing good ideas rather than argue. This is classic but that would be some nice quality of life feature for a better experience.

[Detroo]

If IS-A  asmodians tried to level up rather than just pvp, the level 50 character issue would be resolved.

[Zerocrunk94]

On 7/19/2021 at 8:57 PM, Arazith-IS said:

Using your logic, me(an Elyos) getting ganked at a fort teleporter means that the Asmos have overwhelming numbers. Heck I get ganked at times in Heiron towns at times, especially during EU primetime. Getting ganked or camped doesn't mean anything about the population as a whole. Y'all even have more fort repeats than Elyos do, so I'm not sure what your point is there. There is plenty of population, if you want to see no pop...head to retail, both of those servers combined have less than IS does.

Head to retail? Retails been dead for a while now. But not even 1 month into a launch and a server is already dead? Thats a huge red flag that cant be overlooked. Yes we have more forts to do repeats but its impossible when they same 5 elys are just flying around camping all upper forts and just killing everyone....... groups end up disbanded and welp cant level. If you really think that we dont need a server merger you hoenstly dont have a brain or logic.

57 minutes ago, Detroo said:

If IS-A  asmodians tried to level up rather than just pvp, the level 50 character issue would be resolved.

We are trying to level lol. But its kinda hard when the best flow of XP is upper/lower repeats but the forts get constantly camped by 5-8 lvl50s w full pvp acc and just force gps to disband. We literally are being chocked away from everything. Pretty soon ill see Elys camping DC entrance lol. Thank God Brusthonin doenst have rifts or wed really be done for.

[Arazith-IS]

6 hours ago, Rakionrql said:

At no point did the elyos on Is have close to 600 ppl for siege.  At peak week one maybe 200 elyos sieged. But thats a stretch. Now its like 140 elyos at a siege on IS. 
 

no clue what IS siege numbers for asmos are bc they dont try anymore. 

No where did I mention that there was. I stated that there were that many online, which is important to note in cases like Siel in which both sides have similar numbers but one side has more participation than the other. As far as numbers go, Forthyn has a thread up with numbers for each siege.