Dredge Entry Exploit

[Gullinkambi]

@Kibbelz@Loki

People are gaming the entry system to pick their matches so they can trade AP, are you guys aware of this?

[Zarbi]

1 hour ago, Gullinkambi said:

@Kibbelz@Loki

People are gaming the entry system to pick their matches so they can trade AP, are you guys aware of this?

Groups have been sending in spies to the opposite side in Dredge since it was created in 2009. It's not specific to Aion Classic. They also do it in IB, ID, and AD.

 

[Gullinkambi]

12 minutes ago, Zarbi said:

Groups have been sending in spies to the opposite side in Dredge since it was created in 2009. It's not specific to Aion Classic. They also do it in IB, ID, and AD.

Yes, and they should be banned.

[Zarbi]

Just now, Gullinkambi said:

Yes, and they should be banned.

Not a chance, the only way to prove it is if you are in one of those groups that uses the technique.

 

[Gullinkambi]

Just now, Zarbi said:

Not a chance, the only way to prove it is if you are in one of those groups that uses the technique.

Just pick each person in the game and see how many times they encounter each other person. If it is skewed towards a few people, then they are guilty.

[Zarbi]

2 hours ago, Gullinkambi said:

Just pick each person in the game and see how many times they encounter each other person. If it is skewed towards a few people, then they are guilty.

That would be circumstantial evidence, it would never stand up in court.

[Gullinkambi]

11 minutes ago, Zarbi said:

That would be circumstantial evidence, it would never stand up in court.

I'm not here to discuss if they can take action. Ncwest can ban anyone they want, see Steel Rake ban wave. Besides, it would be blanent if the trend was skewed towards a few people.

[Zarbi]

1 hour ago, Gullinkambi said:

I'm not here to discuss if they can take action. Ncwest can ban anyone they want, see Steel Rake ban wave. Besides, it would be blanent if the trend was skewed towards a few people.

Yeah I thought your post was just trolling for attention, I will leave you to it.

 

[Gullinkambi]

2 hours ago, Zarbi said:

Yeah I thought your post was just trolling for attention, I will leave you to it.

 

None, its a real issue and it's killing the game.

[Neferupito]

Do you mean there is a way to be 100% sure to meet a certain group?

[Arachnia]

If this can be done, to match against particular group, it may not be AP trading, it may be the way to enter driegion at all.  Waiting times are longer and longer. Today i waited over 2h and i gave up...

[Zarbi]

1 hour ago, Neferupito said:

Do you mean there is a way to be 100% sure to meet a certain group?

Nah, in Barnath Dredgion, you can see who is in the opposing team, and their rank before the match starts, so you send in one of your group, not the whole group, and that member reports back in chat if it's ok to enter.  It's by no means an exploit, it doesn't involve the other side at all, so it's not AP trading.

2 minutes ago, Zarbi said:

Nah, in Barnath Dredgion, you can see who is in the opposing team, and their rank before the match starts, so you send in one of your group, not the whole group, and that member reports back in chat if it's ok to enter.  It's by no means an exploit, it doesn't involve any action by the other side at all, so it's not AP trading. It's about avoiding getting rolled by a group full of geared opponents.

 

[Adla]

14 hours ago, Gullinkambi said:

Just pick each person in the game and see how many times they encounter each other person. If it is skewed towards a few people, then they are guilty.

This would not work at all. My Dredge group has had Pho's now so many times in a row that that would count.

It's not possible, and this is not new, neither is dodging for easier gains.

What you should do is post some kind of evidence that you have that leads you to believe this is happening; where is your sourcing?

[Gullinkambi]

If someone is matched with you significantly more times than other others, then you were exploiting the Dredge entry system. I'm not discussing how to exploit the Dredge entry system.

 

5 hours ago, Zarbi said:

Nah, in Barnath Dredgion, you can see who is in the opposing team, and their rank before the match starts, so you send in one of your group, not the whole group, and that member reports back in chat if it's ok to enter.  It's by no means an exploit, it doesn't involve the other side at all, so it's not AP trading.

Your "logic" is the same as this: Throwing a fit at a judge claiming you are a "sovereign citizen" and that you can't be held liable for anything. The judge holds you in contempt and your response is "I did what I did, so it's allowed".

Code of Conduct:

Quote

While participating in Player-vs-Player (PvP) gameplay in the Services, you will not participate in any form of match manipulation. Match manipulation is defined as any action taken to fix or manipulate the outcome of a match or alter or manipulate the rankings or ratings of the ladder. This also includes disrupting other users’ experiences in the Services by not actively participating in good faith (e.g., “griefing” or “leeching”).

 

[Gullinkambi]

I would like to add that there are too many Dredge entry times and there should only be 1 entry time that is 2h long, it would help prevent people from gaming the system and there would be shorter wait times.

[Adla]

1 hour ago, Gullinkambi said:

If someone is matched with you significantly more times than other others, then you were exploiting the Dredge entry system. I'm not discussing how to exploit the Dredge entry system.

 

Your "logic" is the same as this: Throwing a fit at a judge claiming you are a "sovereign citizen" and that you can't be held liable for anything. The judge holds you in contempt and your response is "I did what I did, so it's allowed".

Code of Conduct:

 

Your logic here is flawed, especially when you consider such low populations. My team has never, and would never, exploit anything. Of course that's just my word, and I don't expect you to believe that, but we've had Pho's group(s) 4 or 5 times in the last 7 or so days, if not more. It's highly probable to happen when you consider the low population and fact that teams are made of 6, which consolidates that number even further.

Even in the past on retail for ID, my static would constantly run into familiar/the same teams almost daily.

What you're asking for here is a blanket ban on a lot of innocent people, and it just isn't feasible, and more so, you're approaching the issue with an ignorant outlook...

I encourage refining systems and making them more fair, but this is not the way to do it, and there are far greater things to be concerned about than "teams trading AP in dredge". It's not even a large sum of AP that you couldn't make farming guards in a very short period of time...

I would consider focusing on greater problems, because with this you're wasting your energy on something that likely doesn't exist.


I also ask again, what are your sources to believe this is going on?

[Adla]

And before you select the parts of my reply that only benefit your opinion, because I know already you're just going to dig your heels in on the hill you want to die on, I say again, the probability of running into the same teams has always been high, from retail ID/Dredge of yesteryear to classic today, and even MORE so on classic given the much lower population. That's a key point, and that by no means should be looked at by wasting any GM's time observing this kind of interaction, because mathematically it only makes sense for it to happen.

This kind of thing can't be, and should not be, scrutinized and altered, because the probably of what you're describing happening is very low... The more realistic situation is people using an alt to pop dredge and dodge harder teams for easier wins. Innocent people and teams who simply want to pvp would be harmed by this. It's foolish.

3 minutes ago, Gullinkambi said:

No one asked you. Guilty much?

See, this is what I knew your response would be. Reason flies right over your head, you ignore reality, and you make up some psuedo-justice outlook in your head.

You're either trolling, or you know you're completely in the wrong on this and won't opt to look at it in a realistic way.

It's probably trolling, but never in my life have a exploited anything in Aion, let alone teaming with some other team to trade low-count AP wins... All my team q's for is to pvp. Maybe that's not something you're used to. You probably don't even pop Dredge..... What I offered was real experience in popping ID/Dredge for years and years. It's up to you to ignore it, but not everyone who says you're wrong is your enemy.

 

And still no sources. You've made this up as bait lol.

 

-Regal (SL-E Classic)
-Formerly Aftershock (Retail SL-A/IS-A)

[Adla]

3 minutes ago, Gullinkambi said:

No one asked you. Guilty much?

Ya.. this is a troll but in case it's not I'll give it one last run:

 

 

This is a public forum, you posted something dumb, I'm telling you why it's dumb, and I'm offering aside information to clarify why I think it's dumb through my experience.

So troll away after this if you want. No wonder these forums are so dead with neckbeards like you around.

(and still no sources or evidence....)

[Gullinkambi]

9 hours ago, Neferupito said:

Do you mean there is a way to be 100% sure to meet a certain group?

There are tons of ways to manipulate matches. It doesn't matter, they need to make it really hard to manipulate matches, such as spending entries when requesting to enter, rather than when you actually do enter. Limiting entries to one 2h period per day, perhaps make it 1h cooldown.

8 hours ago, Arachnia said:

If this can be done, to match against particular group, it may not be AP trading, it may be the way to enter [dredgion] at all.  Waiting times are longer and longer. Today i waited over 2h and i gave up...

It's still match manipulating because you are choosing who you face. One could ask people over LFG to make a group, that isn't match manipulation.

[Stormwing]

I  agree that this is a form of match manipulation. I believe that would be easy to fix as well. The whole group should be teleported inside together once everyone pressed Enter.

[Gullinkambi]

12 minutes ago, Stormwing said:

I  agree that this is a form of match manipulation. I believe that would be easy to fix as well. The whole group should be teleported inside together once everyone pressed Enter.

No, the entry needs to be considered consumed when you apply.

[Stormwing]

@Gullinkambi:
Well, I mean the whole group needs to get teleported together - all six at once. That way none can go in ahead and scout.

[Gullinkambi]

11 minutes ago, Stormwing said:

@Gullinkambi:
Well, I mean the whole group needs to get teleported together - all six at once. That way none can go in ahead and scout.

It needs to be considered consumed when you apply, like for arenas in Aion Live.

I'm following how the developers did it for Aion Live.

[Zarbi]

AFK is an exploit.