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Unbeatable-KT

New Server 6.0

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Dear Aion community,

To introduce myself for those who don't already know me, I have been a member of the Aion community and have been playing the game since the BETA days back in summer of 09'. Needless to say, I am your Gandalf to the community and game, and therefore YOU SHALL NOT PASS without reading this thread and perhaps putting your two cents in.

Being a veteran, I have been through every patch and expansion of this game ever since it's release. The pattern with my playing was consistent throughout the first few years from BETA days to 4.x days, with no breaks taken, and after that I would play the following major expansions/patches for a few months and then take breaks in between until the next expansion would come out. Some of you might ask yourself, why? After having a lot of time to think about that question, the answer is rather simple. The game itself was so much better back then than it is now. However, I say that with a grain of salt, as 6.0 has so much potential to get this game back on its right track.

A lot of factors go behind the reason why the game deteriorated over the years, and I'm only going to list the few that have made the biggest impact on the game. The primary reason is the significant decrease in the Aion player population. What people need to stop and ask themselves is why did we get a drastic drop in our player population? The reason once again involves many factors, but the main factor that influenced the deterioration of this game's population and the game itself is NCsoft. Without going into very specific details and deviating what the true point of the topic is, NCsoft has had our fingers pointed at them many times in the past with their decision making and thus consequentially their deterioration of the game.

NCsoft has made this game a grind fest from the moment this game released, to now, pretty much giving away free end-game gear through events and P2W purposes. And then you ask yourself why is the game so dead? Or why do people play the new expansion for a month or two and end up quitting?

North Americans aren't used to grinding in games and we are mostly driven by instant gratification, and thus why we use our wallets so much and expect NCsoft to give us events with free end-game give aways. When this game released, as it was a true Korean game, and all their games require grinding for months on and on, people raised a lot of questions. Will the grinding kill the Aion NA population as the NA population is not used to grinding in games? Everybody thought it would, and as a matter of fact everyone got scared when they saw a significant drop in the Aion population within the first month of its release. But did it kill it? No. All it did, was weed out 1) the people that seek a thrill of a new game and end up quitting a month or two later anyways, and 2) the weak minded fools that would have quit anyways whether they got killed multiple times by the opposing faction, failed crafting an item, or etc. The grinding of the game at its release made this game's population stable and strong, and it has been that way until NCsoft started deviating from that model and how Korean's continued to run the game, to their own means of screwing it up.

Now with every expansion, NCsoft gives us about one month to enjoy the content, in the meantime which they implement P2W methods for people to get an advantage in, and then about a month later they make the end game gear within that expansion easy to get through things such as events. And then we ask ourselves why do we have such a big turnover rate in the population and why do our veterans, such as myself, come back to the game and end up leaving 2 months later? It's not because we are weak minded fools like I previously mentioned the crowd that was weeded out at the release of this game. It's simpler then that. I get all my end-game gear through logging in for events, meaning I don't have to even do an instance or pvp to do so like I did back in the day, which makes me have a full geared character in just two months, and then I can't even enjoy it because the rest of the population does the same... they only log in for events and avoid actual pvp or doing instances, which leaves me as someone who has reached end-game with literally nothing to do.

The reason why MMOs are addictive is due to their sense of progress. This game went from a grind model which implemented exactly that, a sense of progress over the months/years of playing, and thus a low turnover rate because people would actual stay around knowing how much hard work they put in to reach end-game and still have things to do then such as pvp/pve, instead of just logging in to do the event on a daily basis.

With the release of 6.0, the leveling to 80 could be done in a day. While I'm all for the idea of grinding to get your levels, I think that idea only works with the release of a new game and it's first few expansions. But when a game such as Aion has been around for almost a decade, leveling quickly to the end-game level is the right way to modify the game to attract back veterans and new players. To give you an example, once I heard 6.2 released in EU, I went over to try it, only to start leveling the first few levels and almost being like "Why am I going to level to 80, knowing that I am simply using this as a trial to see how this expansion is and I will be playing my regular toon in NA when it releases there". But instead, seeing how easy the leveling was, I reached level 80 within a few hours and was able to enjoy the end-game content the game provided. Why is this significant? Because it attracts veterans and any players that have played in the past without being discouraged that they have to start all over again and have a long way to go. This also applies to completely new players that want to try the game, and would already feel motivated to further progress knowing that they've reached the end-game level in a matter of no time.

Furthermore, 6.0 is a brand new expansion like no other expansion we have had before. Other expansions would give us increased level caps, new pve/pvp instances, and rather minor, but still significant, upgrades in armor/weapons/accessories we would have to work for. This expansion gives us that, and much more. Not only does this expansion revamp the whole system in terms of enchanting and manastone socketing, but it also gives us a whole new beginning. Our previous pve/pvp gear are not usable and because of that we all start off on even grounds with the new pvp/pve gear that's provided in 6.0, and we all go through the same progression. We all start off with 0 kinah. This is the only time in Aion history where an expansion has revamped the system to the point where everybody starts of on the same grounds. Theoretically. Practically, we have ways to prepare to give us major advantage when 6.0 releases. I for example, prepared in the way that my current kinah would translate into thousands of gold bars and supplies that would translate into thousands of legendary PvE/PvP enchantment stones. That in itself will give me a major advantage over anyone that is not doing anything to prepare for it, or especially someone that is about to come back to the game after a few expansions without the opportunity to get a head start like I can or especially a new player that wants to start this game and would already feel discouraged not only having to learn the mechanics of the game but also to fall behind in such a little time of the release of the expansion.

With that said, we have a great opportunity to start this expansion on the right note. On one hand, two factors are at play here to make this expansion great. One, the weight falls on NCsoft to make sure they don't screw it up like they have done with the previous expansions, and this goes in the terms of giving us the end-game content through events and P2W methods, where for example we would get the ultimate xform in just a month or two. And two, giving the returning players and new players a new server for a new revamped system that we see for the first time in Aion history.

To shut down all the negative comments right away, I'm just going to say a few things. I personally have spent over $10k+ on this game. Some of you will say "but then you sound like a hypocrite bashing on this P2W system and preaching for a grinding game?". No. Just no. If I'm given the option to buy my way to the top, I will take it, because the competitive side in me doesn't want me to lose the advantage as it would be lost if I was to do things like a gamer would without having money to spent. With that said, keep in mind that I have already spent so much on this game, both time and money, have end-game gear, and have so much prepared to give me an advantage in 6.0... and I am still rooting for a new server to give everyone a fair start and a blossoming new economy and player environment. Additionally, being the P2W player that I was, I am still rooting for an expansion where NCsoft hopefully won't implement as bad of a P2W system as they have in the past few years so we would actually have to experience the content and instead of swiping our credit cards.

Having tried the new server in EU with the expansion of 6.2 and seeing a population of about 100 level 80 players on each side, you'd be surprised by how much PvE and PvP is happening as this whole new expansion bottle necks everything to one zone. With that said, our servers have 200+ level 75s of each side of each server, so if anything you guys will shortly enough complain that there is too much PvP in the new map if anything. The new server would take away some players from your current population, sure, but it would still leave you with a pretty big population to play with. Up to now, with the 5.x expansion we can easily say that the game is dead because there is so much content and so many maps that no one is doing, but with the 6.x and the same population you will only see how live things are and how much more crowded things are than they are now. My point is, a lot of you might fear that the release of a new server might take away from your population, but trust me when I say, you won't notice the difference, and if anything, you'll complain how crowded the zones are with the current population.

Last but not least, some of you will bring up Beritra as a main argument point against implementing a new server. Beritra was timed completely wrong. Once again something we can blame NCsoft for. They released a new server during a time that we can't even call an expansion. If anything it was a major patch, but it wasn't an expansion such as 4.0 and 5.0 were. The only reason they called it an expansion was because they took away a few zones, merged a few servers, and gave it very minimal extra content compared to other expansions. The timing of it was completely wrong. Mind you, the expansion if we can call it that, only implemented a few extra dungeons and just an extra one or two pve/pvp sets. The idea of a new server was just an idea because people wanted a fresh start just because and they used the excuse of the merges and a new patch being a reason for a new release. All in all, the new server was doomed to fail a few months after as it did, and thus requiring us to further merge it into other servers shortly after. This however, is a completely different ball game. Not only like I previously mentioned is this expansion a whole revamp to the system and is the biggest expansion we have seen in Aion history, but it also gives us a sense of equity with the way that it is revamped, which is the perfect time to implement a new server.

So the people that have been preparing for 6.0 with stocking up on kinah and tempering solutions that will translate you into thousands of gold bars and legendary PvE/PvP enchantment stones, should all stick to your current servers and have that equal advantage once 6.0 starts. The people that are just coming back to the game now or are completely new, a new server would give all fairness to the game and it would be a server to cherish and play on blissfully.

This is directed towards NCsoft mainly (Hime most likely to be the middle man). With proper advertising for the next month, you would be able to gather a ton of new players and have a ton of others return that previously played, and I can guarantee you, nothing attracts people to return or start a new game than a new server. In this case, both the Aion community and NCsoft would benefit from it. Aion community from an influx of people in their population, making it more live, and NCsoft with a bigger income due to an increase in the population.

So let's start off 6.0 on the right note, and let equity with the release of a new server deviate this game back on track.

Cheers,

Unbeatable

 

 

 

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I'm not going to rehash out any arguments for or against it after multiple threads of the same thing. This is something Hime answered the other day:

On 9/27/2018 at 3:39 PM, Hime said:

No plans for new servers or merges currently.

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Currently is the key word. That's what they said before Beritra was "not in plan" to release. For all my years of playing, ever since I can remember, you're the only one that truly spams these forums, but it would be nice if you read the post and perhaps reply with constructive criticism, instead of copying and pasting what Hime said to definitively shut down the topic. Because like I said, when 4.8 was releasing, they also said "no plans for a new server", yet it released. So that hardly means anything to me.

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That's nice. I was conveying current information just in case you missed it because no one looks at dev tracker and it's in a thread with a lot of other info in it.

I've already replied with constructive criticism on the other threads on the subject and always get treated like I'm Satan herself (though it's funny that they often agree with me if I post on an account not named Cheesecake?). I'm not going to waste the pixels on doing it again on this same subject because I'll just get whined at and told how horrible a person I am.

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Aly-DN   

I am also playing on one of the "new servers" in EU. Just like Beritra, for the first week people would take anyone to any instance. But today people began checking gear. "Geared" is appearing more and more often. People laughing at others for not having gear and people crying that they aren't geared enough. It took a week. For the first sieges there were alliances and leagues.. yes. More than one league. Today for Lakrum there was -one- alliance in LFG. The legion I am in had enough people on for an alliance+, but only 8 people joined the alliance. You get more GP solo, just like before. And suddenly the geared people didn't want to risk their GP by taking along someone with lesser gear. It took a -week-.

I guarantee you that that thriving server will be a ghost town in a few more weeks. Vets will return to their old servers and the new people will have left for other games after being locked out of content by those vets.

6.2 will bring people out. Lots of people. They will play and test things out and some of those people may actually stay for awhile. But most will play a few weeks and move on. A new server will be left in a state like the two old ones.. a handful of die-hard players chugging right along. It isn't fare to anyone to have to go through another server merge (loosing names and houses and ranks) because there will be an increase in players for a short period of time.

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Kubei-DN   

It's been discussed many times. Hime said there aren't any plans (and thank goodness for that), a new server would eventually be devastating in the long run. Let's not repeat the same mistake twice, eh?

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I appreciate that you have played since beta. In fact, so have have- and I have not stopped for more than a few weeks since then. 

I say "NO" to a new server, after kahrun AND beritra, plus as others have mentioned above in EU- it's a temporary fix. Sorry, new players have NOTHING invested in the game, and tend to leave quickly- there is still a lot of P2W in 6.x- and a new server is only a sideshow for the veterans, and bleeds off what is NOT a large population now. 

Veterans go back to their old server, and the  for the veterans that remain, it isn't pleasant- there's lot of other reason but frankly I'm tired of justifying it to people who leave for months or more then want their own way ( not saying that's OP).

Edited by Rapier-DN

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9 hours ago, Kubei-DN said:

It's been discussed many times. Hime said there aren't any plans (and thank goodness for that), a new server would eventually be devastating in the long run. Let's not repeat the same mistake twice, eh?

Implying NA Aion is going to have a long run. Only region to not add a new server for a patch designed to attract new players btw.

 

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9 hours ago, Aly-DN said:

I am also playing on one of the "new servers" in EU. Just like Beritra, for the first week people would take anyone to any instance. But today people began checking gear. "Geared" is appearing more and more often. People laughing at others for not having gear and people crying that they aren't geared enough. It took a week. For the first sieges there were alliances and leagues.. yes. More than one league. Today for Lakrum there was -one- alliance in LFG. The legion I am in had enough people on for an alliance+, but only 8 people joined the alliance. You get more GP solo, just like before. And suddenly the geared people didn't want to risk their GP by taking along someone with lesser gear. It took a -week-.

I guarantee you that that thriving server will be a ghost town in a few more weeks. Vets will return to their old servers and the new people will have left for other games after being locked out of content by those vets.

6.2 will bring people out. Lots of people. They will play and test things out and some of those people may actually stay for awhile. But most will play a few weeks and move on. A new server will be left in a state like the two old ones.. a handful of die-hard players chugging right along. It isn't fare to anyone to have to go through another server merge (loosing names and houses and ranks) because there will be an increase in players for a short period of time.

See, the beauty about playing this game is making friends that you can run PvP/PvE instances with. You deciding to queue up in a random party is your personal choice. And just like I wouldn't take a random person off LFG to run Beritra in 4.8 the first few months, I'm pretty sure you wouldn't take a random person, such as yourself, without checking the gear that you have. With that said I already sense that this gear check was for a harder instance, and any instance above CoE (Garden of Knowledge in EU) in terms of difficulty requires quite some skill and gear to complete, so it only makes sense that a gear check for a random person such as yourself is necessary. You getting offended for not being geared enough and them turning you down is just childish. The reason I say that is because spending a week on the new EU server, I have tried with the legion to complete Holy Tower multiple
 times. We know the mechanics of the instance, so that's not the problem, and most of us had full CoE gear, which you could say is decently geared for 1 week of the new server release, but it was still not enough DPS to beat the mechanics and the boss itself. With that said, you can only imagine why people were asking for a gear check if it was Holy Tower, yet let alone any instance harder than that.

As for your comment on "I guarantee you that a new server will be a ghost town in a few weeks" is just as valid as my statement guaranteeing you that it will be the biggest success that Aion has had with an expansion. It's hearsay. But unlike you who is pulling statements out of thin air, if you read my initial post, I actually gave valid arguments why this could be the best thing that could happen to this game.

Also for the GP situation during forts. That's nothing new in this game. We had people running solo to get their GP since the beginning of the GP expansion. I do not see how that is whatsoever relative to the idea of a new server, rather than to the game mechanics itself and the way the GP reward system works.

9 hours ago, Kubei-DN said:

It's been discussed many times. Hime said there aren't any plans (and thank goodness for that), a new server would eventually be devastating in the long run. Let's not repeat the same mistake twice, eh?

I would really love for you to expand on how this would be devastating in the long run. Like I replied to the previous person, it's easy to throw out statements, but it's a little harder to back it up with valid arguments. With that said I am really curious to hear your opinion on how it would be devastating in the long run?

Also repeating the same mistake twice? Beritra was a mistake, there is no denying that. If you read my initial post which seems like you didn't, I even admitted to that. But was Kahrun? No. Kahrun was the best server to be on for the first year of it's release and it would have continued to be until NCsoft started allowing character transfers and people started causing faction imbalances. Unlike Beritra which died a few months after, Kahrun continued to be a regular server to play on just like the rest of them. So when you say "repeat the same mistake twice?", I see them making a huge success with the release of Kahrun and a big fail with the release of Beritra. So the way I see it, they succeeded once and failed once, so what's to say that they will fail again as you mentioned? If anything they will succeed again like they did with Kahrun. Beritra release was during the most random time possible, a release on what we could call a major patch at best and not even an expansion. Kahrun was released with 3.0, which was a huge expansion that added a lot to the game. Now with the release of 6.0, not only is it an even bigger expansion than 3.0, but it also revamps the whole system which makes it that much more of a valid argument for a new beginning.

8 hours ago, Rapier-DN said:

I appreciate that you have played since beta. In fact, so have have- and I have not stopped for more than a few weeks since then. 

I say "NO" to a new server, after kahrun AND beritra, plus as others have mentioned above in EU- it's a temporary fix. Sorry, new players have NOTHING invested in the game, and tend to leave quickly- there is still a lot of P2W in 6.x- and a new server is only a sideshow for the veterans, and bleeds off what is NOT a large population now. 

Veterans go back to their old server, and the  for the veterans that remain, it isn't pleasant- there's lot of other reason but frankly I'm tired of justifying it to people who leave for months or more then want their own way ( not saying that's OP).

Saying no after Beritra, sure I'd understand, even though I argued that the release of Beritra was horrible timing and is nothing comparable to how this release would be. If anything this release would be more identical to the release of Kahrun, and even better. And what was wrong with Kahrun? Having played from the beta days, the first year of Kahrun release was literally the best one year of Aion experience I have had in the past 9 years of playing this game. Kahrun didn't really take away THAT much of a population from the other servers. Needless to say, the other servers were quite well populated and fairly alive. Veterans and new players that played on Kahrun didn't go back to their old servers, rather stuck around as they saw so much potential in it. All in all, I see negativity in your post in regards to a release of a new server mainly due to the most recent experience we've all had, and that was the release of Beritra, but if you look further back, the release of Kahrun was one of  the best things that has happened to this game, and the release of a new server with this expansion has that exact potential... to be one of the best things to ever happen to this game, if not the best thing.

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@Unbeatable-KT c'mon man are you some fan boi? We don't have population to support the 2 servers. You just cannot accept the facts others have already told you.. When we have enough population then MAYBE consider new server till then what Hime said.

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Aly-DN   

Good post, @Magistone-KT! I would urge the staff to take that one step further. If there is a -sustained- population boost, open a new server. Give it a month or 6 weeks. If the numbers continue to rise, open a new server then. When the staff is sure that the population is going to continue to be healthy enough that the third server can stand on it's own without pulling numbers for the already low population old servers, open it right up.

There! Compromise! That should make everyone happy.

 

P.S. @Unbeatable-KT You misread what I wrote. I know it's hard to actually try and understand when someone disagrees with you, but try not to fall back on "mad cuz bad" taunt to discredit my words. It just makes you look foolish. I am not complaining that -I- am not being taken into groups. I don't have the heals stigmas. Just the free dps ones you get. I am not trying to heal anyone. I step into instances with a level 1 alt in group so I can look around and see what things look like so I have info for when 6.2 launches here. I do solo things. I do camps. I quick queue into PvP things so I can check things out. And I don't complain about it. I am looking to see how easy/hard things are and how hard/easy it is to get gear. I am watching what happens on the server. I am an observer. I am seeing the exact same things I saw on Beritra.. where I was also an observer. I joined a legion in EU, but they know I am a NA person checking the patch out and they were cool with that. Groups have been offered, but I just don't have the stigmas to be effective nor the kinah to buy them. I may be bad, but I am not at all mad because I am not staying.

Edited by Aly-DN

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Have to login to reply regarding Kahrun issue xD

Ok kahrun might be good thing that they setup that server but it was horrible mistake when they block creation of elyos characters when in that time asmo numbers are higher than elyos I don't know what were they thinking that point is the turning point leading to kahrun downfall as together people get bored of elyos side and everyone just jumped down together on asmo make asmo super strong.If they didn't block elyos characters and stop creation of asmo characters kahrun won't be dead too soon.

Abit about new server.New server whatever name will be ASMO dominated just like nergal on EU.They will all follow kahrun and berita fate.New server is possible but it needs intensive care and monitor and keep adding adjust according to the population.But as you know about NC they will just open it and do nothing until server merge :|

Edited by Neleth-KT

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8 hours ago, Magistone-KT said:

@Unbeatable-KT c'mon man are you some fan boi? We don't have population to support the 2 servers. You just cannot accept the facts others have already told you.. When we have enough population then MAYBE consider new server till then what Hime said.

If you read my initial post, but like almost everyone else on here, it seems you didn't, you'd see how your point contraindicates as to what I said. So let me copy and paste it for you.

"Having tried the new server in EU with the expansion of 6.2 and seeing a population of about 100 level 80 players on each side, you'd be surprised by how much PvE and PvP is happening as this whole new expansion bottle necks everything to one zone. With that said, our servers have 200+ level 75s of each side of each server, so if anything you guys will shortly enough complain that there is too much PvP in the new map if anything. The new server would take away some players from your current population, sure, but it would still leave you with a pretty big population to play with. Up to now, with the 5.x expansion we can easily say that the game is dead because there is so much content and so many maps that no one is doing, but with the 6.x and the same population you will only see how live things are and how much more crowded things are than they are now. My point is, a lot of you might fear that the release of a new server might take away from your population, but trust me when I say, you won't notice the difference, and if anything, you'll complain how crowded the zones are with the current population."

As you see, the game might feel dead right now with the population we have, but that's simply because we have so much content and so many maps that it's natural for us to feel like we're hardly scratching the surface. But once 6.x releases, everything gets bottle necked down that not only will you feel the server being alive again, but with this current population on here, the one that you define as dead right now, I can almost guarantee you'll start complaining that the new map is too crowded if anything especially having the new EU server to compare it to, which has less of a population than either KT or DN at the moment.

5 hours ago, Aly-DN said:

Good post, @Magistone-KT! I would urge the staff to take that one step further. If there is a -sustained- population boost, open a new server. Give it a month or 6 weeks. If the numbers continue to rise, open a new server then. When the staff is sure that the population is going to continue to be healthy enough that the third server can stand on it's own without pulling numbers for the already low population old servers, open it right up.

There! Compromise! That should make everyone happy.

 

P.S. @Unbeatable-KT You misread what I wrote. I know it's hard to actually try and understand when someone disagrees with you, but try not to fall back on "mad cuz bad" taunt to discredit my words. It just makes you look foolish. I am not complaining that -I- am not being taken into groups. I don't have the heals stigmas. Just the free dps ones you get. I am not trying to heal anyone. I step into instances with a level 1 alt in group so I can look around and see what things look like so I have info for when 6.2 launches here. I do solo things. I do camps. I quick queue into PvP things so I can check things out. And I don't complain about it. I am looking to see how easy/hard things are and how hard/easy it is to get gear. I am watching what happens on the server. I am an observer. I am seeing the exact same things I saw on Beritra.. where I was also an observer. I joined a legion in EU, but they know I am a NA person checking the patch out and they were cool with that. Groups have been offered, but I just don't have the stigmas to be effective nor the kinah to buy them. I may be bad, but I am not at all mad because I am not staying.

I didn't misread what you wrote. My profession requires me to understand my patients' feelings and desires and the hard times they go through with whatever acute or chronic illnesses they might be experiencing, so I can fairly competently say if anything I'm good at reading people and understanding what they're saying, as I don't hold those skills just within the professional aspects of things but also with regular interactions with family and friends on a daily basis. So no, I didn't misread or misunderstand you.

I never called you bad in the first place, or did I ever indicate that. That's just putting words in my month. But I did mention the fact that all I meant by what I said, your gear, or in this case your stigmas are not up to par as to what the group expected out of you, and you just have to work towards that. That doesn't make you bad. It just means you have to actually put in the work to get to that stage. And seeing as you've called yourself an "observer" many times in your post, how can you even get mad about the fact that they declined you. Once again it goes along the premises of you being an undergeared character in 4.8 release and wanting to get carried in doing Beritra within the first month of release. It's completely unreasonable.

3 hours ago, Neleth-KT said:

Have to login to reply regarding Kahrun issue xD

Ok kahrun might be good thing that they setup that server but it was horrible mistake when they block creation of elyos characters when in that time asmo numbers are higher than elyos I don't know what were they thinking that point is the turning point leading to kahrun downfall as together people get bored of elyos side and everyone just jumped down together on asmo make asmo super strong.If they didn't block elyos characters and stop creation of asmo characters kahrun won't be dead too soon.

Abit about new server.New server whatever name will be ASMO dominated just like nergal on EU.They will all follow kahrun and berita fate.New server is possible but it needs intensive care and monitor and keep adding adjust according to the population.But as you know about NC they will just open it and do nothing until server merge :|

I completely agree with you.

NCsoft messed up when they blocked off elyos creation. Was it the downfall of the server? No. It just made it harder for the elyos side to do anything, but unlike some people who would look at that in a negative way, I took it as a challenge and well basically said "bring it on". So while I agree that blocking off elyos creation made a big impact on the initial balance of the server, the balance was not that far off, and the server was completely playable and enjoyable to the max. What caused a complete imbalance? When they opened up character transfers and other more geared Asmo players started showing up on the server and throwing the faction balance completely off. Until that happened, the server was the best 1 year experience of my 9-year Aion gaming.

But here is the thing that we have to ask ourselves. With Kahrun, the blocking of the elyos creation and the opening of character transfers... who's fault was that? NCsoft's. But does it have anything to do with the idea of a new server? No. Absolutely no. Like I said, Kahrun's first year was the best Aion gaming experience I've ever had, and the release itself was an amazing decision on behalf of NCsoft. The blocking of elyos creation and opening of character transfers was their screw up, but it has nothing to do with what's being talked here, and that's releasing the new server. Because if anything, in that regard, NCsoft did an amazing job when they released Kahrun, although they messed up later on.

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On 29/09/2018 at 11:37 PM, Unbeatable-KT said:

NCsoft has made this game a grind fest from the moment this game released, to now, pretty much giving away free end-game gear through events and P2W purposes. And then you ask yourself why is the game so dead? Or why do people play the new expansion for a month or two and end up quitting?

I get all my end-game gear through logging in for events, meaning I don't have to even do an instance or pvp to do so like I did back in the day, which makes me have a full geared character in just two months, and then I can't even enjoy it because the rest of the population does the same... they only log in for events and avoid actual pvp or doing instances, which leaves me as someone who has reached end-game with literally nothing to do.

The reason why MMOs are addictive is due to their sense of progress. This game went from a grind model which implemented exactly that, a sense of progress over the months/years of playing, and thus a low turnover rate because people would actual stay around knowing how much hard work they put in to reach end-game and still have things to do then such as pvp/pve, instead of just logging in to do the event on a daily basis.

Agree with you here. Once we actually played instances to get gear with that horrible RNG, but still, we kept trying. The moment everything became obtainable on the broker/with luna, there was no need to actually play the game anymore. Farming events with alts and camping the broker became the main activity. I've never seen so many players online and yet afk/still like in Aion. However, a new server doesn't mean that NCW would change behaviour. This is something deeply linked with the game's management, it won't be magically solved with a new server. Maybe only with a new publisher.

Up to now, with the 5.x expansion we can easily say that the game is dead because there is so much content and so many maps that no one is doing, but with the 6.x and the same population you will only see how live things are and how much more crowded things are than they are now. My point is, a lot of you might fear that the release of a new server might take away from your population, but trust me when I say, you won't notice the difference, and if anything, you'll complain how crowded the zones are with the current population.

Beritra was timed completely wrong. Once again something we can blame NCsoft for. They released a new server during a time that we can't even call an expansion. If anything it was a major patch, but it wasn't an expansion such as 4.0 and 5.0 were.

The fact that there will be less contents/maps, it means that the people that quit Aion because interested in the lore/exploration/PvE, won't stay much longer after coming back to check (if they will ever do it). There are less maps to explore, less dungeons to run... if you already left the game because it's boring, I don't see why they should stay afterward. The PvP might be more interesting, I give you that, but you won't recover most of the playerbase lost with just packing all the players in 1 single map.

About Beritra, iirc, it was opened because NCW tried for the second time to advertise the game through Steam. They expected a lot of players (like they/we expect now from the 6.2) but they didn't arrive. Almost all of them were veterans who re-rolled on the new server (exactly what would happen now opening a new server).

On 29/09/2018 at 11:37 PM, Unbeatable-KT said:

See, the beauty about playing this game is making friends that you can run PvP/PvE instances with. You deciding to queue up in a random party is your personal choice. And just like I wouldn't take a random person off LFG to run Beritra in 4.8 the first few months, I'm pretty sure you wouldn't take a random person, such as yourself, without checking the gear that you have.

Kahrun was the best server to be on for the first year of it's release and it would have continued to be until NCsoft started allowing character transfers and people started causing faction imbalances. Unlike Beritra which died a few months after, Kahrun continued to be a regular server to play on just like the rest of them.

I don't think Aly was complaining for the gear check itself. The point is: you want to open a new server for the new/returning players, right? Not for the veterans like you that want to reroll (like for Beritra). Then you should realise that these more casual players have a slower pace than the average. Soon they will realise to be cut away from several contents + there will be less contents in general = why keep playing?

+1 for Kahrun, I agree. Though, the game was different back then. The game still had good contents and there were active players when Kahrun opened. You can't expect that a new server will be as successful just because it happened once.

And seeing as you've called yourself an "observer" many times in your post, how can you even get mad about the fact that they declined you. Once again it goes along the premises of you being an undergeared character in 4.8 release and wanting to get carried in doing Beritra within the first month of release. It's completely unreasonable.

She didn't go mad. She just stated that even after few weeks, this magical bubble of a "fresh start" already vanished. That's usually when returning players quit again. It's like when there is a new event: everyone gives it a try and play it. After 1 day, you already see in LFG "Rank S, only experienced" and casuals stop running them.

There are too many elistists and toxic players in Aion nowadays, if you don't give casuals/returning/new players something meaninful to do, only the same old players will keep playing after a couple of months. And for them, a new server is pointless.

 

NCW has been lucky is its lazyness, to be able to see how things are developing on EU side. Just look at the recent comments:

https://board.en.aion.gameforge.com/index.php/Thread/3752-YES-or-NO-6-2-Brand-NEW-SERVER-OPEN/?postID=70826#post70826

Players are complaining that the old servers are now empty and a merge is required.

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Agree with you here. Once we actually played instances to get gear with that horrible RNG, but still, we kept trying. The moment everything became obtainable on the broker/with luna, there was no need to actually play the game anymore. Farming events with alts and camping the broker became the main activity. I've never seen so many players online and yet afk/still like in Aion. However, a new server doesn't mean that NCW would change behaviour. This is something deeply linked with the game's management, it won't be magically solved with a new server. Maybe only with a new publisher.

I completely agree with you on this. I agree with the fact that the release of a new server itself won't work. But that's why I previously mentioned that the release of a new server will only be able to work if NCsoft complies with 1) the release itself, 2) advertises on time, which should be starting out now and not dropping the bomb pretty much the day before like they did with Beritra and 3) change their management, not drastically, but even partially, with for example decreasing their form of P2W methods and cutting back with giving out free end-game stuff with each event.

Quote

The fact that there will be less contents/maps, it means that the people that quit Aion because interested in the lore/exploration/PvE, won't stay much longer after coming back to check (if they will ever do it). There are less maps to explore, less dungeons to run... if you already left the game because it's boring, I don't see why they should stay afterward. The PvP might be more interesting, I give you that, but you won't recover most of the playerbase lost with just packing all the players in 1 single map.

About Beritra, iirc, it was opened because NCW tried for the second time to advertise the game through Steam. They expected a lot of players (like they/we expect now from the 6.2) but they didn't arrive. Almost all of them were veterans who re-rolled on the new server (exactly what would happen now opening a new server).

This is where I personally completely disagree.

You said it yourself with the previous quote, people now-a-days don't play the game anymore for experiencing its content, and instead their play time revolves around farming events with their alts and camping the broker as their main playing activity. So realistically ask yourself this - Out of the population that currently plays, what % of it actually plays for the content that's provided (ie. PvP/PvE instances, lore, exploration, etc) and do things other than log their alts and play the broker? Correct me if I'm wrong but we can probably agree that that % is almost hardly to none. Needless to say, I think you see where I am headed with this point. In the direction to point out that people even in this current version of the game don't play it for the lore, exploration or its PvE/PvP content, yet let alone to think that's what people will be looking for in 6.0 and will be disappointed when it's cut down and bottle necked into one zone. If it doesn't affect the player population now, it won't affect it then.

With that said, keep in mind, what makes an MMO long lasting and addictive is the level of progress within it, and not it's lore, exploration, quantity and quality of PvE/PvP instances, or anything else. Don't get me wrong, those things still play a role in making the game appealing, but what makes people stick through in a game is the level of progression in it. Take a look at WoW for example. How many expansions have you heard that the player base have called bad, yet people still stuck through with it because they knew that no matter what content we throw at the playerbase population, as long as there is a level of progression, and it's not instantly gratified in 1-2 months like it is with each Aion expansion, then it is worthwhile sticking around and thus why that game still has millions of players even after almost two decades.

Like I previously mentioned, if NCsoft would only simmer down their P2W methods to a minimal, and cut out the free end-game gear give aways with each event... with the combination of this new expansion that gives us a sense of progression like no other expansion in the past... this expansion has the potential of putting this game back on track and has a great potential on welcoming back our veterans and a new crowd of people, with an even greater chance of them sticking around this time than in any other expansions released in the past.

I have to emphasize one more time how huge level of progression we are getting with 6.0. It is comparable to the grind that we had to experience on the release of the game. In comparison to the last few expansion where we basically have to grind one instance to get the next best gear, here in 6.0 we have to do just that but on top of that we have to obtain that gear first and then upgrade it twice more. This is why with the right cards at play, this expansion, a readjustment in the way NCsoft runs things and a new server could be the best thing that happens to this game.

Quote

I don't think Aly was complaining for the gear check itself. The point is: you want to open a new server for the new/returning players, right? Not for the veterans like you that want to reroll (like for Beritra). Then you should realise that these more casual players have a slower pace than the average. Soon they will realise to be cut away from several contents + there will be less contents in general = why keep playing?

+1 for Kahrun, I agree. Though, the game was different back then. The game still had good contents and there were active players when Kahrun opened. You can't expect that a new server will be as successful just because it happened once.

But we see this in any game we play. The elites vs the casuals. We see this in our every day life too. Just like life teaches us, however many hours we put into a skill/task is how experienced we become in it and how rewarding it is in the end, this is a similar mentality with gaming. And while yes the casuals will eventually fall behind the elites on a new server within a few weeks time, you have to understand the gap between the new player and veterans on their would be much less than compared to on one of the current servers where the margin would be exponentially more.

Not only that, but think about it this way. If you're a new player, you already have to worry about learning the mechanics of the game, and on top of that with starting off on an old server you have to worry about being an outlier within the population and having a noticeable margin between you and your end-game players. This is what actually makes people quit immediately. On the other hand, with a new server release, a new player still has to worry about learning the mechanics, but they start off on the same foot as everybody else... yes their progression will be slower than the veterans, but having that few week period to feel equity amongst the player population is just enough time for the player to stick around as comparison to joining an old server and quitting right away.

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Depending upon how "progression is interpreted-  I 'm not all that excited about having to enchant gear to +15, then use that to get another grade to +15, then turn THAT gear into another set that I have to enchant AGAIN for both PVE and PVP. In that sense 6.0 is NOT in any sense interesting progression, it's a cash grab gear grind typical of the worst P2W games trying to get money, with no imagination or thought in its game design.

Add RNG in there in multiple areas (stats, transforms, etc)- forget it. I would much rather have instances that demand some technical progression, either gating through quests, and/or exploration or difficulty. Stupid, repetitive gear grind is boring as hell. I want interesting content and good PVP- hey, just like in the subscription days!

And a new server still makes no sense at all, you just made a  stronger argument in your last paragraphs for having new players on the same server as veterans in fact.

 

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25 minutes ago, Rapier-DN said:

Depending upon how "progression is interpreted-  I 'm not all that excited about having to enchant gear to +15, then use that to get another grade to +15, then turn THAT gear into another set that I have to enchant AGAIN for both PVE and PVP. In that sense 6.0 is NOT in any sense interesting progression, it's a cash grab gear grind typical of the worst P2W games trying to get money, with no imagination or thought in its game design.

Add RNG in there in multiple areas (stats, transforms, etc)- forget it. I would much rather have instances that demand some technical progression, either gating through quests, and/or exploration or difficulty. Stupid, repetitive gear grind is boring as hell. I want interesting content and good PVP- hey, just like in the subscription days!

And a new server still makes no sense at all, you just made a  stronger argument in your last paragraphs for having new players on the same server as veterans in fact.

 

You're a representation of everything that's wrong with Aion and everything that killed Aion.

"I want NEW NEW NEW content, that's gonna be easy and rewarding, and not grindy with a lot of RNG." Once again, North American mentality and the reason why each expansion lasts about 1-2 months before the population dies down again. It's because of people like you who would rather want new content with a progression that is rather instantly gratified with the work you put it and with no chance of failing (mainly indicating to enchanting/socketing).

The game stood it's ground when this game was a grind fest almost a decade ago, and the way I see it, is that that model worked, and the model you seek for is the one that's killing the game.

As for the new server idea, you're the only person in this thread that doesn't seem to have his marbles all aligned up in the head, so I'll let you re-read my paragraph first and then please do explain to me how what I wrote makes it a stronger argument for having new players on the old servers.

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2 minutes ago, Unbeatable-KT said:

You're a representation of everything that's wrong with Aion and everything that killed Aion.

"I want NEW NEW NEW content, that's gonna be easy and rewarding, and not grindy with a lot of RNG." Once again, North American mentality and the reason why each expansion lasts about 1-2 months before the population dies down again. It's because of people like you who would rather want new content with a progression that is rather instantly gratified with the work you put it and with no chance of failing (mainly indicating to enchanting/socketing).

The game stood it's ground when this game was a grind fest almost a decade ago, and the way I see it, is that that model worked, and the model you seek for is the one that's killing the game.

As for the new server idea, you're the only person in this thread that doesn't seem to have his marbles all aligned up in the head, so I'll let you re-read my paragraph first and then please do explain to me how what I wrote makes it a stronger argument for having new players on the old servers.

For someone who claims that, and I quote

"My profession requires me to understand my patients' feelings and desires and the hard times they go through with whatever acute or chronic illnesses they might be experiencing, so I can fairly competently say if anything I'm good at reading people and understanding what they're saying, as I don't hold those skills just within the professional aspects of things but also with regular interactions with family and friends on a daily basis. So no, I didn't misread or misunderstand you."

where, in anything did I write, did I say that I wanted instant gratification? 

That's right? NO WHERE. What I said is that I did not see anything "progressive", or FUN, about grinding away just to mindlessly enchant gear. Where's the fun in that? What I do find fun is exploring, learning the lore, doing interesting quests, and learning interesting and challenging game/instance mechanics.

 You seem to have a serious issue with anyone who doesn't agree with you. I seriously doubt that you deal with anyone in a professional capacity  as you claim. You would definitely not remain a member of any reputable  professional organization as such.

 

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@Unbeatable-KT I assume your a PvPer

@Rapier-DN I assume your a PvEr.

I doubt you to will ever see eye to eye.

 

Now that is out the way lets get on to the main point. Is a new server good? Yes however not from Ncwest. We know they do 0 advertising and the players in the NA region have the saltiest of the salt selection for a playerbase..

Edited by HealingSquid-KT

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1 minute ago, HealingSquid-KT said:

@Unbeatable-KT I assume your a PvPer

@Rapier-DN I assume your a PvEr.

I doubt you to will ever see eye to eye.

Actually, you're wrong. 

Note that I've played since closed beta, I've rarely been out of the top 30 rank. If anything, I prefer  PVP, in general- at least in Aion.

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Long time no see @Unbeatable-KT

"I am still rooting for an expansion where NCsoft hopefully won't implement as bad of a P2W system as they have in the past few years"

I am sadly not as optimistic about 6.2 as you are; quite the opposite in fact. Aside from the fact that I absolutely hate what they did to chanters this patch, it's the worst ever patch for f2pers because of transformation contracts. At least in this current patch and previous patches, you could be a f2per and still have p2w-level +25 gear just by grinding on alts. You don't have that luxury anymore in 6.2 on top of the fact that the contracts cost 12mil and can only be purchased once a week. Steel shared a video clip on facebook showing a guy opening 200 contracts and only getting 4 yellows out of it; it seems like getting a red transformation will take thousands of contracts to get, and it's basically mandatory to get this transformation to stay competitive considering how much run/attack/cast speed it gives. In other words, for a f2per, getting a red transformation through grinding will take years.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is: what good is having a bottlenecked open world experience when the stat disparity between p2winners and f2pers is bigger than ever? Seems like the f2pers will just be easy fodder for the Marchutan/Kaisinel xforms.

"The grinding of the game at its release made this game's population stable and strong, and it has been that way until NCsoft started deviating from that model and how Korean's continued to run the game, to their own means of screwing it up."

I completely agree that NCSoft's decision to deviate from the old grind model helped accelerate the game's decline. I just want to add to that the horrible decision to implement fast-track, which killed off rift PvP, and the fact that we've been getting new gear at a much faster rate, incentivizing people to spend more on the cash shop to keep up with every gear reset.
 

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Bryos-DN   

No matter whether you consider the killing of low level PvP and favouring a faster grind good or bad (despite being very very clearly their best decision ever), there is always the undeniable truth that without it, we wouldn't have a game right now.

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8 hours ago, Unbeatable-KT said:

You said it yourself with the previous quote, people now-a-days don't play the game anymore for experiencing its content, and instead their play time revolves around farming events with their alts and camping the broker as their main playing activity. So realistically ask yourself this - Out of the population that currently plays, what % of it actually plays for the content that's provided (ie. PvP/PvE instances, lore, exploration, etc) and do things other than log their alts and play the broker? Correct me if I'm wrong but we can probably agree that that % is almost hardly to none. Needless to say, I think you see where I am headed with this point. In the direction to point out that people even in this current version of the game don't play it for the lore, exploration or its PvE/PvP content, yet let alone to think that's what people will be looking for in 6.0 and will be disappointed when it's cut down and bottle necked into one zone. If it doesn't affect the player population now, it won't affect it then.

Correct, the CURRENT playerbase probably won't be much affected by the removed contents (although even in this forum there are threads of people loudly vocing their discontent for the removed maps/threaten to play on private servers. A small % though, as you say.

But there's no point in opening a new server for the current playerbase. The point in case is to attract the people who've already quit Aion. And these players quit because the game changed too much. Everyone can say their own reasons: too much gap between veterans and casuals, too much p2w, too many boring and repetitive dailies, too many hackers. Probably all of them. You must change these things before opening a new server. A new patch & server are useless to attract old players if NCWest doesn't change the reasons why they quit. And from what we see, NCW is still the same lazy and understaffed company, too dependant on what Korea does.

[..] the gap between the new player and veterans on their would be much less than compared to on one of the current servers where the margin would be exponentially more.

Not only that, but think about it this way. If you're a new player, you already have to worry about learning the mechanics of the game, and on top of that with starting off on an old server you have to worry about being an outlier within the population and having a noticeable margin between you and your end-game players. This is what actually makes people quit immediately. On the other hand, with a new server release, a new player still has to worry about learning the mechanics, but they start off on the same foot as everybody else... yes their progression will be slower than the veterans, but having that few week period to feel equity amongst the player population is just enough time for the player to stick around as comparison to joining an old server and quitting right away.

The first weeks of a new server will be a good moment for a new player to start. No doubt. Even if I don't expect so many new players starting to play Aion (mainly returning). I don't see any advertisement (in addition to the new banner on that old website of ours, and you can't really count on the word-of-mouth, since for Aion is not a positive one). IF the gap between the players who play/pay a lot and casual players will be less than now (I'm not so naive to say "minimal", but just say less than now), then probably the patch will be a success and a new server does have a meaning. There is a big IF though. We still don't know how the cash shop will be here on NA. The advantage to play on a new server, for new players, will only last few weeks in any case (and all of us must farm a new gear, even on the old servers, since there's no comparison with the current stats). The only advantage for the veterans, will be the kinah at their disposal. And it's up to NCW to don't put anything valuable on the cash shop.

Personally I'm surprised that NCWest won't open it. As I said in another thread, a new server would generate more profit for them. But they can always open it later on. If the 6.2 is really a good patch for new/returning players too, they will stay and then a new server will make sense. The mistake done with Beritra, was to open it in anticipation of a bigger playerbase. If you don't want to repeat the same mistake, first you wait to actually have that bigger playerbase, then you open a new server.

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I'm also a "settler of aion" (not that I think that matters) and I don't feel a new server would help any.  It would just be something that would need to be merged later.  People are already quitting / threatening to quit in droves in EU over the new transformation system which essentially removed basic funtions of the game and created a new PTW system.  Some quite literally days after the patch when their compensation potions ran out after a few hours.  

I'm not going to scour for specific quotes, but I disagree with quite a bit in here insomuch as each argument really only applies to some portion of the playerbase.  

For example, the grind conversation vs. quick-grind.  I've had friends who joined Aion based on my recommendations back in 1.5/1.9 who got stuck in their 30s and quit the game as they figured it would take way too long to catch up to the level 50s and it wasn't worth the effort to them.  Others may level fast and get bored and then leave.  It's a tradeoff over the types of players you are looking for.  The MMO genre is a little dated and younger players are playing things like Fortnite - a lot of MMO vets are adults with limited time so being able to feel like you got something done in a couple hours is a big deal to many players these days.

I disagree that people aren't playing the game for PVE content, lore, quests, etc.  I for one play for these reasons.  I'm mortified as to how much of this they are removing to funnel everyone into a couple areas.  The only reason this content is devalued is because the events are so OP in the rewards they give, it doesn't make sense to focus on anything else when a good event is going on.  Many people actually came out way ahead doing nothing but afking during afk events.  This is just a problem with their events devaluing content, not the content being worthless on its own.

Personally while 6.2 will feel like it's levelling the playing field, which has some merit, I fully expect future events to throw out gear and things that later this month will require lots of grinding.

 

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